"I think the Windows 8 system is no better than the previous Windows Vista platform," Funny guy. Now we are all using W7 as the greatest OS of all times, and the truth is it has very few improvements over Vista. Almost all key technology was already in Vista and were just polished for W7. The same will happen again. W9 will be seen as great, even if it really is going to have mostly polished W8 features.

Like How XP was for years? and still is the most used os? most people that go from XP are probably gonna go to 7 simple cause the win 8 interface

IPlayNaked makes a very good point. A lot of people are starting to trade their laptops and desktops for tablets and smartphones. A guy at work asked me the other day if he could buy an iPad because he wants something portable but doesn't want a laptop. Unfortunately, I had to tell him that an iPad won't work because the websites we use are designed for IE exclusively and run a browser detection script to prevent them from loading in Safari, Chrome, FF or Opera.... Most of the people I deal with regularly would rather buy tablets or smartphones....if they didn't need their laptops/desktops for their day to day activities.

When win8 first came out I hated it, now I'm giving it a shot but there is far less to like about it than to dislike however Win Blue should be out by the summer it's really a service pack but not in the straight sense because it will have a price tag similar to OS X upgrade trend. Hopefully we will see an improvement jump like 7 was to Vista. Yet I still fail to see the point of touch implementation on all desktops the only way for MS to win people over is to integrate their Metro bundle into programs and features and allow users to disable it to suit their preferences and also ban Ballmer from MS as he has difficulty understanding what the majority users want.

Windows has supported touch interfaces since at least Windows98. It's nothing new.... MS is just trying to create a user experience similar to what Apple has done with OSX/iOS. At least MS didn't pull a Google and create something as useless as ChromeOS.....

Windows 8 is fine for tablets, hybrid tablets and touchscreen setups. But It really does not belong on standard desktop computer. Seriously, Microsoft should have just left the old Start Menu in there as an "option", as ther exists no technical reasons whatsoever for them to not have done so.

I had to get W8 because my old laptop is dying, and there are no decent W7 machines left on sale that meet my requirements (new). It isn't horrible, but I like it much less than W7.

Windows 8 is fine for tablets, hybrid tablets and touchscreen setups. But It really does not belong on standard desktop computer. Seriously, Microsoft should have just left the old Start Menu in there as an "option", as ther exists no technical reasons whatsoever for them to not have done so.

People have been complaining for years that Microsoft hasn't been "innovative"....but any time they make an attempt at it, people complain that MS changed something. You can't have it both ways. "Innovation" requires change....and this was a change that needed to be made. The world is moving towards tablets and smartphones and away from desktops....as much as it sucks to say that...it's true. For MS to remain relevant, they have to prove they can develop an OS (or multiple OS's) that can support multiple devices. They also have to provide a fluid, seamless transition between all devices running "Windows"....as well as a familiar experience. That isn't possible if you're using 3 completely different UIs.

Innovative lol, there is nothing innovative with the Modern UI. And innovation cannot be forced, it has to be encouraged. Telling people to "use this or else" is never a good thing, and what needs to be done is to give people reasons why they should use something and how it benefits them. But again, there exists no technical limitations for there not to be a Start Menu, and as long as there doesn't the Start Menu should be there for those who want it.

Telling people to "use this or else" is never a good thing, and what needs to be done is to give people reasons why they should use something and how it benefits them.

They already did that. They have a math behind all the changes up on their Building 8 blog and every time someone posts it the response usually is "I DONT CARE TI SUCKS" oh, ok. There are a hundred different Start Menu apps for Windows 8, if you don't like the start use one of them. There is no reason that Microsoft should have to carry it's legacy features forward, that's what leads to bloat.

They already did that. They have a math behind all the changes up on their Building 8 blog and every time someone posts it the response usually is "I DONT CARE TI SUCKS" oh, ok.

Ooooh they did math, cool! Because everything in the world can clearly be calculated with a mathematical equation. 🤓

There are a hundred different Start Menu apps for Windows 8, if you don't like the start use one of them.

Or you know, I could just use a superior OS instead like Windows 7.

There is no reason that Microsoft should have to carry it's legacy features forward, that's what leads to bloat.

No reason? lol I would have thought the outcry and poor sales telling otherwise would have been reason enough. It is after all the number one criticism of the OS, and by far the main reason its not selling better.

Ooooh they did math, cool! Because everything in the world can clearly be calculated with a mathematical equation. 🤓 Or you know, I could just use a superior OS instead like Windows 7. No reason? lol I would have thought the outcry and poor sales telling otherwise would have been reason enough. It is after all the number one criticism of the OS, and by far the main reason its not selling better.

... And that is exactly my point. Instead of going and reading the blog, or about Fitt's Law and disproving it or something; you just completely ignore it. And yeah you could use Windows 7, never said you couldn't nor do I care what OS you use, it's not superior though -- at best it's a sidegrade. There is very little outcry, it's no where near Vista and it's funny because the only place I see complaints is on enthusiast sites. In real use, I've installed the OS on 9 varying computers of people I know and absolutely none of them had a problem using it. Most of the elderly people like it because it's easier to see what they are clicking on. As for poor sales, they are roughly the same as Windows 7 sales. You could argue it's worse due to Windows 8 only being $40 at launch but whatever. Most windows sales are coming through OEM channels and the bottom line is no one is buying PCs anymore. I can't think of a single friend in the last 2-3 years that has bought a PC, most of them switched to iPads or similar android tablets. Or they just use their phone for computing. I'm starting to head the same way. I'm sitting here with a very expensive computer and like 4 games are worth playing, all of which can be run on a $600-700 setup.

Deleted, sorry.

After watching a video that a fellow guru3d member posted in the OS thread in the topic Windows 7 or 8. I am happy to stick with Windows 7. I have had a stable Windows 7 install for 3 years now. If it aint broke dont fix it. When I upgrade my current setup in the Summer of 2014 I will still Use Windows 7.

If it aint broke dont fix it.

No offense but I absolutely despise this line of thinking. Can you imagine if cave men sat down and were like "Well this cave is mighty fine! Why build civilizations and the wheel and stuff! If it ain't broke don't fix it!"

No offense but I absolutely despise this line of thinking. Can you imagine if cave men sat down and were like "Well this cave is mighty fine! Why build civilizations and the wheel and stuff! If it ain't broke don't fix it!"

Well, in the case of those cavemen, there wasn't much to fix. 😉 But i agree, Samsung is just looking for a scapegoat for the declining PC market. Everyone is falling over the Metro UI (isn't that bad if you're used to it), but even if W8 didn't have Metro it would still get the blame. The logical outcome of this is that PC's as we know it are slowly transforming in more portable devices.

I agree about with the statement regarding "Windows 8 bashers" and "Enthusiast websites". They go very well together. Whilst I'm in IT everyone I've spoken with (noobs) generally love it because it's quick, clean and modern whereas a few members in my team bash it. Heck even I bashed it at first but using it again and again I'm starting to love it.

I agree about with the statement regarding "Windows 8 bashers" and "Enthusiast websites". They go very well together. Whilst I'm in IT everyone I've spoken with (noobs) generally love it because it's quick, clean and modern whereas a few members in my team bash it. Heck even I bashed it at first but using it again and again I'm starting to love it.

And I think this is exactly the situation. Unfortunately, those who are quick to judge, bash, and recommend staying behind are slowing already slow sales due to their ignorance and incompetence. The comparisons with Vista are invalid. Vista at launch was riddled with driver and stability issues. It wasn't polished, and changed a little too much in how the underlying framework operated. Windows 8 is a simple UI change over Windows 7. It's a matter of taste, not stability, not usability. Those who claim to be tech oriented are unfortunately pushing their knee-jerk tastes onto those less knowledgeable. It's unfortunate, and it's why you see so little innovation these days. Because those of us who are the loudest, or supposed to be the most trustworthy, don't like it, and actively attempt to shut down anything that is change.

... And that is exactly my point. Instead of going and reading the blog, or about Fitt's Law and disproving it or something; you just completely ignore it.

I actually read it and concluded it was complete nonsense aimed at trying to justify forcing their flawed UI on people. At the end of the day, their math means absolutely squat, its the customers they need to please. Funny thing is, pretty much everyone I know dislikes Windows 8, and the vast majority of them aren't even enthusiasts, just average joe's with a computer.

I actually read it and concluded it was complete nonsense aimed at trying to justify forcing their flawed UI on people. At the end of the day, their math means absolutely squat, its the customers they need to please. Funny thing is, pretty much everyone I know dislikes Windows 8, and the vast majority of them aren't even enthusiasts, just average joe's with a computer.

They aren't forcing anything on anyone. You have to be completely brain dead to believe this line of bull****. In order for something to be "forced"...there has to be a complete lack of choice. This isn't the case. You have the choice to stick with XP, Vista, 7, etc. However, blaming Microsoft and Windows8 for the decline in computer sales is a load of **** as well. PC sales have been declining for more than 2 years now. The economy is **** and those able to, are going mobile. Those who's day to day activities don't require a desktop or laptop, are replacing them with tablets and smartphones.....if they're replacing their current setup at all. Over the next few years, we'll see further declines in PC sales and a greater move towards AIO systems or completely mobile. Samsung can't dominate the PC market and they're looking for someone to blame for their pathetic laptops not selling.....of course, they can't blame Google for ChromeOS being a massive failure so MS has become the obvious choice... Most of the "Average Joes" I know....are going mobile... The few staying with laptops, don't care 1 way or the other what the UI looks like, so long as it provides e-mail access and runs their games.

I just ditched Windows and went back to Linux, I win :P (Though I do keep my Windows partition for gaming, but everything else is on Linux now). deltatux

They aren't forcing anything on anyone. You have to be completely brain dead to believe this line of bull****. In order for something to be "forced"...there has to be a complete lack of choice. This isn't the case. You have the choice to stick with XP, Vista, 7, etc. However, blaming Microsoft and Windows8 for the decline in computer sales is a load of **** as well. PC sales have been declining for more than 2 years now. The economy is **** and those able to, are going mobile. Those who's day to day activities don't require a desktop or laptop, are replacing them with tablets and smartphones.....if they're replacing their current setup at all. Over the next few years, we'll see further declines in PC sales and a greater move towards AIO systems or completely mobile. Samsung can't dominate the PC market and they're looking for someone to blame for their pathetic laptops not selling.....of course, they can't blame Google for ChromeOS being a massive failure so MS has become the obvious choice... Most of the "Average Joes" I know....are going mobile... The few staying with laptops, don't care 1 way or the other what the UI looks like, so long as it provides e-mail access and runs their games.

If you want to take advantage of the new functionality and kernel upgrades, then yes you are forced to use the new UI if one does not want to bog down ones computer with third party programs. And I never once said or even implied that Windows 8 was responsible for the decline of PC sales.

If you want to take advantage of the new functionality and kernel upgrades, then yes you are forced to use the new UI if one does not want to bog down ones computer with third party programs. And I never once said or even implied that Windows 8 was responsible for the decline of PC sales.

Still not seeing it. From a user perspective the new launcher is simply better. You get 70? Tiles I think? @1080p Within one click while in 7 you get 10. You also get more information from said tiles. I can navigate the UI just as easily as I could with Windows 7 - granted it took me a few weeks to adapt and get the muscle memory down but now I can snap my mouse to a tile across the screen before the animation even finishes playing. And that's if I'm even using the mouse. Keyboard input is significantly faster compared to mouse, which makes the difference in application launch near identical in both OS's. Then you have the math perspective, but I guess you just don't believe in math that's been tried and tested for over 60 years so we'll ignore that. From a Microsoft perspective they have a huge problem on their hands. While they maintain a huge dominance over the PC market, they have little to nothing in mobile. Their best bet to gain some traction was to leverage their PC market dominance onto mobile by combining the two. Now when a user buys a Windows 8 PC, they are familiarizing themselves with the interface for all of Microsoft's mobile units. With cloud integration and apps from the Microsoft Market and you're building an ecosystem from the top down. Overall the interface gives a slight sidegrade in the worst case scenario for Windows desktop users, a massive upgrade in Windows mobile users and Microsoft a nice boost in the creation of their ecosystem. Couple that with all the other enhancements of Windows 8 and for $40 it's a great deal. At the full retail cost, I don't know, could be worth it for some others probably not. Either way you can use 3rd party software that's probably more efficient than the legacy code Microsoft would have used to replicate Windows 7 functionality. Even if it is "bloated app" or whatever the memory enhancements in Windows 8 alone make up for the difference and then some so it's really a non-issue.