Nvidia responds to AMD FreeSync

Spets

2014-01-08 12:27

4K Monitor with G-Sync If anyone missed it, 4k monitor running G-Sync:

But at the NVIDIA booth at CES this year the company was truly showing off G-Sync technology to its fullest capability. By taking the 3840x2160 ASUS PQ321Q monitor and modifying it with the same G-Sync module technology we were able to see variable refresh rate support in 4K glory. Obviously you can't see much from the photo above about the smoothness of the animation, but I can assure you that in person this looks incredible. In fact, 4K might be the perfect resolution for G-Sync to shine as running games at that high of a resolution will definitely bring your system to its knees, dipping below that magical 60 Hz / FPS rate. But when it does with this modified panel, you'll still get smooth game play and a a tear-free visual experience.

http://www.pcper.com/news/Graphics-Cards/CES-2014-NVIDIA-Shows-Modified-ASUS-PQ321Q-4K-Monitor-G-Sync

#4739564

lucidus

2014-01-08 12:30

This para is a bummer about FreeSync 🙁

However, Petersen quickly pointed out an important detail about AMD's "free sync" demo: it was conducted on laptop systems. Laptops, he explained, have a different display architecture than desktops, with a more direct interface between the GPU and the LCD panel, generally based on standards like LVDS or eDP (embedded DisplayPort). Desktop monitors use other interfaces, like HDMI and DisplayPort, and typically have a scaler chip situated in the path between the GPU and the panel. As a result, a feature like variable refresh is nearly impossible to implement on a desktop monitor as things now stand.

Edit: the comments on that site are interesting. Apparently Displayport 1.3 capable monitors will have all this fancy stuff built in so Gsync won't be of much value in the long run.

#4739605

Fox2232

2014-01-08 13:32

And that is why I no longer buy nVidia GPUs. I do not want to support business model which intentionally locks everything they make on multi-vendor platform. And telling things like: "It does not exists because we don't know anyone who make it.", or that "feature like variable refresh is nearly impossible to implement on a desktop monitor as things now stand" is like saying: "competitors effort is certainly going to fail". I would AMD let to do their part with VESA as always. And all of us will benefit in the end. AMD users with nice feature to have and nVidia users with add-in cards cheaper than now as nVidia will be forced to lower price. But as some of legit reviews already stated, G-Sync looks amazing in comparison to classical 60Hz, but is only minor to no improvement against 120Hz+ displays. And honestly who would invest to 144Hz screen to play at 50fps? One day we will have Oled with real 0.001ms refresh time paired with up to 300Hz FreeSync/G-Sync and that would be real improvement. As it stays now it has more point to have FreeSync/G-Sync on low Hz screens as it has very high benefit for them and in combination with laptops it's ideal.

#4739620

Ryu5uzaku

2014-01-08 13:43

On freesync we have to wait till we know which displays have it and which do not. But at least it should be a standard on 1.3 then? Cause that makes all kinds of difference when I am in near future looking for UHD 10bit displays again 😀

#4739630

gUNN1993

2014-01-08 13:49

This para is a bummer about FreeSync 🙁 Edit: the comments on that site are interesting. Apparently Displayport 1.3 capable monitors will have all this fancy stuff built in so Gsync won't be of much value in the long run.

Don't Korean monitors not have this scalar chip, due to there being only 1 input? Tried to find the source for that information, but can't, may have imagined it.

#4739638

eclap

2014-01-08 13:58

Don't Korean monitors not have this scalar chip, due to there being only 1 input? Tried to find the source for that information, but can't, may have imagined it.

Koreans (the single input ones) have a bypass board. Meaning it's gpu straight into the panel, no pcb in between. So in a way, similar to laptops, where there's nothing in between either.

#4739650

tugCREW

2014-01-08 14:18

still, there's progress somehow.

#4739657

BUDA20

2014-01-08 14:29

There is already a specific demo or test program to download?, like the pendulum or that wind turbine, where?.

#4739661

Ven0m

2014-01-08 14:38

There is already a specific demo or test program to download?, like the pendulum or that wind turbine, where?.

Just play games and look for tearing, especially on horizontal camera/object movement: - tearing = v-sync off - minimal tearing = v-sync off and 120Hz - stuttering, lag, no tearing = v-sync on and <60fps - minimal stuttering and lag, no tearing = v-sync on, 120Hz monitor, 40-60fps - no stuttering, no lag visible = g-sync or v-sync with 60fps+ (even with 60fps+, vsync can add minimal lag)

#4739695

BUDA20

2014-01-08 15:36

Thanks for the reply, but I'm looking for useful tool for testing. Any download links for any of these programs?

#4739706

eclap

2014-01-08 15:56

Thanks for the reply, but I'm looking for useful tool for testing. Any download links for any of these programs?

Nope

#4739729

nhlkoho

2014-01-08 16:28

And telling things like: "It does not exists because we don't know anyone who make it.", or that "feature like variable refresh is nearly impossible to implement on a desktop monitor as things now stand" is like saying: "competitors effort is certainly going to fail".

They are going to fail. Nvidia obviously did the research and found that the only way to make this work on desktop displays is to design and implement the G-Synch module. They even said in the interview "Nvidia's intent in building the G-Sync module was to enable this capability and thus to nudge the industry in the right direction." This direction is to have displayport 1.3 on all monitors going forward. If AMD put any effort into this at all they would have shown this off on a modern desktop PC. But no, they put something together quick to make sure everyone knew that they had this technology too. Just as a sidenote, I walked into my local BestBuy yesterday and out of the 30-40 monitors they had on display, 2 of them had displayport inputs. Everything else is DVI/HDMI. The display industry has progressed very little in the last few years.

#4739734

eclap

2014-01-08 16:35

don't think it's a port limitation no matter how you swing it.

#4739765

Seref

2014-01-08 17:03

It's dumb that there's not a lot of DisplayPort monitors on the market. You can get Korean 1440p monitors with DisplayPort ffs.

#4739776

eclap

2014-01-08 17:18

It's dumb that there's not a lot of DisplayPort monitors on the market. You can get Korean 1440p monitors with DisplayPort ffs.

can you? where? and again, where does it say free-sync/gsync is only doable via dp?

#4739793

Anarion

2014-01-08 17:46

can you? where? and again, where does it say free-sync/gsync is only doable via dp?

http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphics-Cards/AMD-Variable-Refresh-FreeSync-Could-Be-Alternative-NVIDIA-G-Sync You can't do that stuff through DVI, it just doesn't have the capability.

#4739807

eclap

2014-01-08 18:01

http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphics-Cards/AMD-Variable-Refresh-FreeSync-Could-Be-Alternative-NVIDIA-G-Sync You can't do that stuff through DVI, it just doesn't have the capability.

again, that's eDP is not display port, if we want to be accurate. most likely ran on eDP because DP is the smallest video connector so embedding a DP is a lot easier in laptops (where components have to be smaller). I still haven't seen anything to say that this can't be done on DVI

#4739819

JonasBeckman

2014-01-08 18:17

again, that's eDP is not display port, if we want to be accurate. most likely ran on eDP because DP is the smallest video connector so embedding a DP is a lot easier in laptops (where components have to be smaller). I still haven't seen anything to say that this can't be done on DVI

it includes a new Panel Self-Refresh (PSR) feature developed to save system power and further extend battery life in portable PC systems.[21] PSR mode allows GPU to enter power saving state in between frame updates by including framebuffer memory in the display panel controlle

( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DisplayPort ) Something about these features not being supported under DVI, HDMI or even regular Display Port 1.2 currently, thus AMD demoing this using eDP on laptop, or so I understood it. 🙂 (Apparently DP 1.3 will have something like that, unsure about HDMI 2.0) Someone else can likely give a better explanation. 🙂 (I believe GSync also requires DP for now although that could likely be adapted to DVI and HDMI since it's a external controller module.)

#4739824

Asgardi

2014-01-08 18:23

"I would AMD let to do their part with VESA as always. And all of us will benefit in the end. AMD users with nice feature to have and nVidia users with add-in cards cheaper than now as nVidia will be forced to lower price." In the end its good to have cheap/free tech for everybody but I will support companies who actually do innovations to get some more. If we always supported copycats there would not be the innovations to share. I don't want companies to make money with the same stuff for forever, but for some time is just healthy and motivating.

#4739840

toivonen

2014-01-08 18:52

lol...and that is why latelly i passed to the "green" side!...sure, theire very far from beeing saints, but when we look to the last 5 years, they really had a much better attitude, both in the tecnology as in posture....AMD, despair takes no where, you should know that....