@Agonist i compared the cheapest chip of the biggest series, meaning FX vs what is out right now, and even the 8/8 version (FX) was still cheaper, so yeah. and we 1. weren't talking about value, but price 2. value is not a feature, its only connected to how much money ppl have. e.g. the only ppl that will argue a +1M$ super sports car has bad value and cost of insurance/maintenance/gas/tires is too high, are the ones that dont have the means. or compare food prices of the stuff you bought last time, to what the same items cost 10y ago. did the stuff get better in the same amount the price went up?? @Aura89 i wanted tom compare price to recent cpu, and i wasnt looking at model number, but smallest chip with 8C, and even then, its ~300$ (1700) vs +400$, increase in price either way.

Aura89:

There's no 5700x to compare the the 3700x to. If AMD never releases a 3700/x, then sure you're right. But the 5000 series hasn't even been released yet and who knows what will happen in the future. Never has the entire lineup released at once. And it's clear he was talking about 1st gen to 4th, not 3rd to 4th, as you stated 1800x $499 2800x non-existant 3800X $399 5800X $449

if they straight up eliminate a tier and replace it with a more expensive one tha'ts all u have to compare with i would argue that its perfectly valid to compare the 5800x to the 3700x when there isn't a direct replacement its like the cheese way to raise prices and somewhat justify it.

fry178:

and even then, its ~300$ (1700) vs +400$, increase in price either way.

Depends on what's released in the future. I highly doubt AMD will only release 1 8-core CPU for the 5000 series. More then 2? Who knows. Time will tell. But to be honest it's a weird statement either way, given the fact you don't compare products against higher end products just because they are both 8 cores. a 5600x could best your 3700x for all you know and cost less. If you want to just compare cores get a 8350 on ebay for like $60 bucks and call it good or a Xeon E5-2658 8-Core for $18 on ebay.

icedman:

if they straight up eliminate a tier and replace it with a more expensive one tha'ts all u have to compare with i would argue that its perfectly valid to compare the 5800x to the 3700x when there isn't a direct replacement its like the cheese way to raise prices and somewhat justify it.

This is very invalid in multiple ways. At least at original release date. Never has AMD released all CPUs at the same time, we don't know what is coming. If AMD never releases a cheaper 8-core CPU then sure, the 5000 series for 8-core will sit at $449 for both lowest and highest end 8-core CPU, but given historical information, it's unlikely that AMD will only release one 8-core CPU. If this same logic could be applied everywhere, then AMD is releasing the most expensive lineup ever, due to having no products under the 3600x currently announced. Which means AMD from last generation went from their cheapest product 3100 at $99 to their cheapest product 5600x being $299 It doesn't work that way, only the future will show how many products are released and at what price points.

Aura89:

It doesn't work that way, only the future will show how many products are released and at what price points.

AMD could just continue some of the products from the previous generation instead of replacing them all.

If there is a 3060 I will wait for Zotac to make one that fits in my NUC9i9QNX.

sykozis:

AMD could just continue some of the products from the previous generation instead of replacing them all.

That's worked out for previous generations but I'm not so sure it will this time around. Reason being that Ryzen 3000 and Ryzen 5000 are on the same process node, which is most definitely supply-constrained. Why spend 7nm wafers on Zen 2 chiplets when you could make Zen 3 chiplets instead? Especially as AMD have to build up inventory of good, fully enabled Zen 3 chiplets for next-generation EPYC demand. I'd expect Ryzen 3000 processors to be around for a while but I wouldn't be surprised if supply, as well as demand, dropped off quite quickly. Regarding the pricing of GPU midrange champions it's worth keeping in mind that the Radeon 5700XT is $400 and that's a Polaris replacement (RX 480/580/590 equivalent). Historically we've had cards from both vendors hitting specific price points for comparable series but increasing prices are definitely here to stay. Rather than get too focused on naming it's probably best to look at pricing, what does a certain amount of money get you for a particular architecture or point in time? We're still a ways from knowing what Ampere, or Big Navi, will deliver in the $200 to $300 price range but when we do that should be compared to what similarly priced Turing or Navi cards rather than get too hung up on the naming scheme.

Hmm, a 3060 Titanium sounds good. Let's see some results first.

sykozis:

AMD could just continue some of the products from the previous generation instead of replacing them all.

Absolutely possible. Doesn't mean i think it's likely. Only future will tell. If by the time Zen 4 comes around there's still no lower end 8 core processors, then we can determine that Zen 3 8 cores was overall more expensive, due to the fact it only included the higher end part.

Nvidia going full panic mode, probably can’t even get the majority of cards out before 2021 either. Pretty damn embarrassing if you ask me.

Embra:

So $500+ for the 3070? So many rumors.

Cheapest preorder for he 3070 here is around 450€ so... yeah?

gmavignier:

Seems like a big line up: 3090, 3080, 3070, 3060Ti, 3060... Matbe a 3050 option in the future as well? IMO it's too many options. The lower we go, the harder it is to find the best bang for buck.

Well don't forget that it's 3090, 3080 Ti, 3080, 3070 Ti, 3070, 3060 Ti, 3060, 3050 Ti, 3050..... if they continue the logic. So many chips needed to fill out that lineup.

DannyD:

I had a blast with Control raytracing, like Fing hell it was amazing, DLSS works friend.:)

You had fun with one game, yay! ONE GAME! I tried Control for 30 minutes and uninstalled the game: piece of crap. Opinions, I know, but RT isn't worth a GPU costing 2x over the previous gens. I just want a normal good performing card without dedicated cores BS that is the best price/performance I can get with my small budget. AMD, please deliver!

fry178:

funny how everyone expects stuff to cost the same, forever. how about the price for entry in "top series" chip like the FX 81xx (180$), now im paying +310$ for a 3700.. do you guys also expect to pay the same for everything else? show me more than three common things of everyday life, that didnt increase its price in the past 10/20/30y? avg house in europe was 50K in late 70s and now its 250K, cars that were 50K are now 150K (911 turbo), food and many other things the same..

You had better inform the hard drive and SSD manufacturers that they're doing things wrong. I'm sure they'll be happy to hear that they can infinitely increase their prices 🙄.

@Prince Valiant shhhh, lol i didnt mean prices going up compared to last gen, but overall prices going up. and ppl draw the line at something like pc hw, that most users wont even replace regularly/yearly...

Silva:

You had fun with one game, yay! ONE GAME! I tried Control for 30 minutes and uninstalled the game: piece of crap. Opinions, I know, but RT isn't worth a GPU costing 2x over the previous gens. I just want a normal good performing card without dedicated cores BS that is the best price/performance I can get with my small budget. AMD, please deliver!

Your attention span is lacking. Control is great game and probably even better experience with raytracing.

Undying:

Your attention span is lacking. Control is great game and probably even better experience with raytracing.

That's an opinion..... His opinion obviously differs from your's. Not everyone likes the same games.

jbscotchman:

With the way this launch has gone my excitement for this has definitely calmed down. Think I'll just wait till early next year when everything has settled down, plus I'd like to see how it does in some early XSEX games like AC Valhalla and Dirt 5.

that's always the wisest stance. best prices are usually 4 to 6 months in

March would be best time for me, if CP2077 doesn't eat more than 10gb then perhaps vanilla 3080, or i may go wayward and grab 3080ti if available. I imagine by March there'll be options on the mid-high end available to actually buy, also if big navi is able to support Witcher3 RT day1 that would be interesting.

sykozis:

That's an opinion..... His opinion obviously differs from your's. Not everyone likes the same games.

You're not wrong, but it was Silva who went out of his way to sorta attack the fact the guy he quoted had fun with a game. Like, fine, silva doesn't like ray tracing, or doesn't like the fact that it's not in a bunch of games, or doesn't like that it's the future, whatever his opinion is. Doesn't mean it had to effectively attack someone who enjoyed a game with all of it. If Silva is going to go out of his way to say a game is trash and complain that someone enjoyed playing a game all under the guise of "Opinions, I know" then he should expect the same back, regardless of someone claiming opinions or not. There realistically was no reason for him to comment on that guys post.

@Aura89 I'm sorry if it looked like an attack, I have no problem with others having fun. What I wanted to say is that he only gave one example of a game that runs with RT and he had fun. Most competitive games you'd just disable the feature because high fps obviously better. I have nothing against RT, all games should just switch and only use it. But do we have hardware for it? No. And while on the topic of hardware silicon real state is expensive, what I'm really against is the price increases for something that doesn't work on all games and I can't see a real improvement over existing visuals. Pay more to turn the features off, that's what I'm against. This said, it will be interesting how AMD will implement RT and what does it mean to keep a competitive product that can render both ways. I'm more interested in price/performance, not something that tanks my framerate if I turn it on!