Neo Cyrus:

It is, but sometimes (especially in the past) the Canadian prices were just straight up higher than US prices. The actual US MSRP might be lower. The retarded DDR5 prices are why I went for the 5800X3D and didn't bother wait to see how Zen 4 will turn out.

That makes sense, i'm in for for a Motherboard, CPU and Ram upgrade. So i'm waiting on both AMD and Intel to release their Hardware and make a choice after i've read reviews. Still not sure about a GPU upgrade yet. My 3080 is doing fine at 4k for me atm.

I don't think the price matters much (not the launch price at least). Prices will almost always (*cough* crypto mining *cough*) be relevant to performance. If the price is "too high", they wont be selling enough and will lower prices to "reasonable prices". It is relative to the performance of other competing products (not just intel but also previous gen). The reason Ryzen 5000 was expensive was because it was really good compared to ryzen 3000 and even intel. The reason everyone and their mother is expecting GPUs to drop now in prices is because we understand that both AMD and nVidia have a large stock to get rid off and both are about ready to launch new products. I know a lot of people are saying that nVidia and AMD can "stall" their launches of the new GPUs to move old stock of 6000 / 3000 series (obviously AMD is twice better 😀), but remember: They have to release quarterly earnings. They don't especially want to show a quarter with extremely low income from gaming GPUs because "They are stalling". They want to move chips and make more chips and sale those chips again. Not speculate on the price of the chips they already made (especially when gamers are already used to waiting for price drops). However, My understanding is that AIB partners are the ones that got burned the worst with the crypto bubble, and these guys already have a rather slim margin as it is on GPUs. It is an interesting situation to say the least. So in CPUs, I expect something similar. If there is a lot of demand (Honestly, i don't see it. Ryzen 5000 was really good value, I expect people to skip 7000 considering how it looks like this 5nm architecure / node is not bringing any revolutionary performance increase.... that we know of as of today), maybe price will follow.

Catspaw:

The reason Ryzen 5000 was expensive was because it was really good compared to ryzen 3000 and even intel.

No, not at all. it may be that way when looked at from a partially informed perspective. the reality the 5000 series was more expensive was because of TSMC. AMD had secured exclusivity and primacy for x86/x64 fabrication at node before the construction of the fab(s) and had guaranteed (along with Apple and Qualcomm) production windows for those fab(s) to a literal tune of billions of dollars over time from 1st gen Ryzen. you will see a similar price hike with Intel with ML and its successors as the bills come due for all of the new fabs built.

tunejunky:

No, not at all. it may be that way when looked at from a partially informed perspective. the reality the 5000 series was more expensive was because of TSMC. AMD had secured exclusivity and primacy for x86/x64 fabrication at node before the construction of the fab(s) and had guaranteed (along with Apple and Qualcomm) production windows for those fab(s) to a literal tune of billions of dollars over time from 1st gen Ryzen. you will see a similar price hike with Intel with ML and its successors as the bills come due for all of the new fabs built.

His right about the pricing , if the product was worse then intel it would of been cheaper it’s very simple, if the product is better then the competition it would be priced higher. The information you gave has little to do with the end pricing of a product.

~AngusHades~:

His right about the pricing , if the product was worse then intel it would of been cheaper it’s very simple, if the product is better then the competition it would be priced higher. The information you gave has little to do with the end pricing of a product.

quite wrong. the cost of manufacture has everything to do with retail prices and there are no two ways about it. i've been in electronics manufacturing for decades. thank you for telling me i don't know how to boil an egg.

mohiuddin:

So AMD is the new Intel or so as it seems

AMD were never any better than Intel or Nvidia when it came to their pricing. They were cheaper for years for a reason, they didn't compete. These prices are a joke.

metagamer:

AMD were never any better than Intel or Nvidia when it came to their pricing. They were cheaper for years for a reason, they didn't compete. These prices are a joke.

You seem to forget the days of the K-7 and K-8. Lots of competitive CPUs back then. Especially the K-8.

metagamer:

AMD were never any better than Intel or Nvidia when it came to their pricing. They were cheaper for years for a reason, they didn't compete.

This. 100% true, but too many people didn't see through that and simply went all fanboy instead of comparing products beyond their bias.

And...So, again it has nothing to do with what kind of industry it is. A company that manufactures a product, whatever it is, will sell the products at a loss even if it costs more to manufacture it / produce it, as it can't compete in the market. The gentleman above that you quoted is right about the pricing. AMD priced Zen3 higher because it was a better product than intel at the time.

Horus-Anhur:

You seem to forget the days of the K-7 and K-8. Lots of competitive CPUs back then. Especially the K-8.

Keller days

Astyanax:

Keller days

Zen is also Keller. And probably, also Alder Lake.

tunejunky:

quite wrong. the cost of manufacture has everything to do with retail prices and there are no two ways about it. i've been in electronics manufacturing for decades. thank you for telling me i don't know how to boil an egg.

so how much of 330 to 450 eur price hike from 3700x to 5800x was manufacturing cost ?

Horus-Anhur:

Zen is also Keller. And probably, also Alder Lake.

Theres a pattern forming.

Astyanax:

Theres a pattern forming.

Could be. Another CPU contending for the top spot is Apple's A series. That also started to be competitive with a guy named Keller.

Keller is probably an alien from outer space, or a time traveler ... in any of these cases, his mission is to advance human technology to the point of being ready for integration in the Galactic Federation.

cucaulay malkin:

so how much of 330 to 450 eur price hike from 3700x to 5800x was manufacturing cost ?

1) compare the comparable not one model below to one model up 2) the 3800x MSRP was $399 3) no, the answer isn't $50 - the answer is $25, which then gets marked up for profit by another $25

tunejunky:

1) compare the comparable not one model below to one model up 2) the 3800x MSRP was $399 3) no, the answer isn't $50 - the answer is $25, which then gets marked up for profit by another $25

Im comparing launch prices for 8 cores.amd didnt launch 5700x until very late for a reason and that reason is exactly what im pointing to.

cucaulay malkin:

Im comparing launch prices for 8 cores,why 5700x if it came waaaay later.

because it's apples to apples, instead of apples to oranges the 7800x will also come out "waaay later"

tunejunky:

because it's apples to apples, instead of apples to oranges the 7800x will also come out "waaay later"

Why no 5700x on launch then ? To limit the options and milk the consumer.now theyre going a step further 7700x is going to be more expensive than last gen 5800x was. I know theyre going to be good,but the cost of 7700x is going to be a few hundred eur vs. 12700f if you count the board and ddr5 vs ddr4.

I think that manufacturing costs are taken into account when pricing a product, but it is not the defining factor. I would say that manufacturing cost is taken far more prominently into account when deciding if you should launch/manufacture that product in the first place. Considering that the second decision is made years in advance, what usually happens is this: 1. You try to make a good product and a competitive price. 2. You get an engineering sample and test how good it is. 3. You compare it to current products and extrapolate improvements over your own products and the competition products 3 - 5 years into the future. 4. If it looks good, you secure fab production and try to improve the design until production beings (even something after, thats why we have different revisions of the same products) 5. As fab yield improves, you can price your products more aggressively, greatly increased by chiplet design (this is why 16 core CPUs are so much more expensive per core than 12 core CPUs, because 2 times 8 cores per chiplet means a 0% defect chiplet, 12 cores are 2 times 8 cores with two cores per chiplet not working properly, thus disabled). 6. You finally have your product out and... it turns out Intel has a better cheaper CPU. So, does your manufacturing price matter or what matters is to sell those chips you already have made, paid for and are gonna be a cost only on your balance sheet if you keep them? (Btw, this almost never happens. I think only companies like Sennhesier and Porsche would operate at a loss for a long time in some departments just because they knew they would recoup that loss in other ways). Ryzen 5000 had 3 advantages over Intel: 1. Motherboard compatibility (with even 300 series nowdays). This basicly cut from the cost of upgrade the motherboard, another windows key and sometimes even RAM. Considering that, Ryzen was SO MUCH CHEAPER than Intel. 2. Chiplet design (better yield due to maturity of the architecture, the chiplet design and the infinity fabric, remember that Ryzen 1000 was rather poor in gaming due to early infinity fabric being quite new). 3. Competitive performance.