AMD 6nm Zen3+ Ryzen 6000 Rembrandt SoC Gets More Detail

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#5994104
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Undying:

Integrated Radeon 680M Zen 3+ graphics with RSR can outperform the GeForce GTX 1650 Max-Q
I think on paper it can outperform a 1650. The problem for iGPUs always comes down to memory bandwidth.
#5994106
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RED.Misfit:

I had the impression that all rumors pointed to Raphael lineup to come with an iGPU. And that there was no plan to have CPU without iGPU at first (variant could come out in 2023 without it) But there has been no official announcement/statement, so i would not ruled out an iGPU, wether it's all the lineup or only some CPUs.
yeah, i was just going over the materials AMD emailed me. afaik, zen4 (7000 series) will initially be released w/o iGPU please note the word "initially". as for die size...ryzen are soc's, so the i/o die is a different node than the processor dies. there is no fundamental reason why they are leaving out iGPU, as some models won't have full core counts. the only physical limitation is the AM5 platform itself. my speculation is that AMD is keeping the 5nm node higher end for recouping production costs AND having Rembrandt (6000 w/apu) series have the new uArch, but at the well proven 6nm (and less expensive) node so they aren't leaving out the lower end (which used to be their wheelhouse).
#5994107
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schmidtbag:

I think on paper it can outperform a 1650. The problem for iGPUs always comes down to memory bandwidth.
This ^ Based off rumors I suspect AMD is going to have a modular approach to memory for RDNA3 that might benefit APU's a ton. Need to see what they did exactly because that is pure speculation.
#5994116
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JamesSneed:

This ^ Based off rumors I suspect AMD is going to have a modular approach to memory for RDNA3 that might benefit APU's a ton. Need to see what they did exactly because that is pure speculation.
umm rdna 2 for apu's and although this is zen 3+, the power management and memory are brand new uArch. it does remain to be seen so i agree w/ you, but there is a hell of a lot going on here. just on power alone this more than doubles the battery life against (HX) their own apu and that's way more than 1nm node differential can account for. and of course, ddr5 require new controllers so, yeah they've been fiddling about.
#5994139
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CPC_RedDawn:

You will be waiting a while. Desktop APU's in the 7000 series lineup will be using Zen3+ cores not Zen4 from what I have seen so far. You are looking at a 2023 release at the earliest.
When it comes to APU the most important thing for a lot of people is the GPU inside. RDNA 2 compute units looks to be a big step forward for APUs and Zen 3+ gonna be good enough as the CPU part of it.
#5994159
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MonstroMart:

When it comes to APU the most important thing for a lot of people is the GPU inside. RDNA 2 compute units looks to be a big step forward for APUs and Zen 3+ gonna be good enough as the CPU part of it.
Yep I totally agree. I have a 4650G in my ITX rig in the living room and coupled with 3200MHz CL14 RAM (4GB VRAM allocation) its actually a beast for light gaming workloads. I can only imagine this exact chip with RDNA2 cores instead of VEGA, easily double if not more the performance. They have to come with DDR5 support though and the ability to uncouple the IF ratio from 1:1 so we can push for higher RAM speeds and therefore more bandwidth for the GPU. Hopefully by the time these release for desktops DDR5 prices will be lower. I'd love to upgrade my ITX rig 🙂
#5994184
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i've been waiting on the AL nuc to come out as it is "modular" w/a gpu slot. my thinking was htpc w/gaming. now, between Intel pushing the release back & cutting models i want this. oh sure, it will be another six months before we see a sff product. idk about Minisforum, but i'd buy a Gigabyte Brix or Zotac whachamacallit in a heartbeat. put this in the den with controllers and (the old tv) run xbox live and play all the games? the "Brix" and the xbox live (for a year) combined will be around 1/2 price of 3070...
#5994197
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Just bought a laptop for work outside and a bit of gaming, but those Ryzen 6000 seems to be very very good.
#5994198
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CPC_RedDawn:

Yep I totally agree. I have a 4650G in my ITX rig in the living room and coupled with 3200MHz CL14 RAM (4GB VRAM allocation) its actually a beast for light gaming workloads. I can only imagine this exact chip with RDNA2 cores instead of VEGA, easily double if not more the performance. They have to come with DDR5 support though and the ability to uncouple the IF ratio from 1:1 so we can push for higher RAM speeds and therefore more bandwidth for the GPU. Hopefully by the time these release for desktops DDR5 prices will be lower. I'd love to upgrade my ITX rig 🙂
they probably won't have to decouple the infinity fabric for current ddr5 , as it stands the current cezanne chips can do 2200-2400 (4400*4800mt/s) in 1:1 mode reliably , on an enhanced node (6nm) >4800mt/s shouldn't be an issue. its important to remember that they would have to widen the data path width like intel has done, inorder to get more bandwidth at lower data fabric speeds(double and quad data rates are possible, but would likely use too much power for what is a laptop chip), Which probably isn't in the cards for Rembrandt at least(almost certain for what ever comes after however because of avx 512). edit:minor correction
#5994406
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user1:

they probably won't have to decouple the infinity fabric for current ddr5 , as it stands the current cezanne chips can do 2200-2400 (4400*4800mt/s) in 1:1 mode reliably , on an enhanced node (6nm) >4800mt/s shouldn't be an issue. its important to remember that they would have to widen the data path width like intel has done, inorder to get more bandwidth at lower data fabric speeds(quad data rates are possible, but would likely use too much power for what is a laptop chip), Which probably isn't in the cards for Rembrandt at least(almost certain for what ever comes after however because of avx 512).
what they did do was change the entire i/o and power management uArch. there are capabilities for individualized sleep states of componentry and specialized power management for the infinity fabric tho' i believe (not sure) it's a 128 bit bandwidth. so the power and and sleep envelopes change dynamically...i.e. you can be doing heavy maths without the igpu power draw etc..
#5994569
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tunejunky:

i've been waiting on the AL nuc to come out as it is "modular" w/a gpu slot. my thinking was htpc w/gaming. now, between Intel pushing the release back & cutting models i want this. oh sure, it will be another six months before we see a sff product. idk about Minisforum, but i'd buy a Gigabyte Brix or Zotac whachamacallit in a heartbeat. put this in the den with controllers and (the old tv) run xbox live and play all the games? the "Brix" and the xbox live (for a year) combined will be around 1/2 price of 3070...
I am at this point as well. I want a SMALL QUIET console size or smaller than console size box with a GOOD CPU/GPU/Low latency RAM, descent sound and KB/M and 4 Joypad controllers in the living room. Add WIFI-6E/AX or whatever for wireless VR later (looking at PSVR2 headset)... That's it. NO RBG Bling Bling or other designer case tax.
#5995252
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tunejunky:

umm rdna 2 for apu's and although this is zen 3+, the power management and memory are brand new uArch. it does remain to be seen so i agree w/ you, but there is a hell of a lot going on here. just on power alone this more than doubles the battery life against (HX) their own apu and that's way more than 1nm node differential can account for. and of course, ddr5 require new controllers so, yeah they've been fiddling about.
Yeah AMD did an awesome job with perf per watt. I suspect outright perf will be helped by more memory bandwidth however AMD pulls it off. I do suspect we will see some kind of Infinity Cache or on chip memory like Apple's M1.
#5995425
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Undying:

This is really impressive https://www.linkpicture.com/q/FL9CL3fWUAIPibx.jpeg
looks like its still going to be choking somewhat badly on the lack of memory bandwidth, with a 50% increase in shaders and a 20% inscrease in clock speed + rdna's architectural improvements, you would expect a bit more. hopefully faster ddr5 becomes more widely available, it might even catchup to something like a fury 😀 in some senarios

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