Intel Expands 10nm Manufacturing Capacity
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fantaskarsef
No, no, no Intel....
Yeah, we've heard that before. Years. Time and time again.
Loophole35
All reports are that 10nm is actually "fixed" and able to be produced in volume.
tunejunky
good news for Intel.
but as Intel's 10nm equals everyone else's 7nm, they're still a node behind
Stormyandcold
That doesn't mean anything because Intel can use everyone else as well. Their options is actually more like everyone else +1.
Black_ice_Spain
Intel density is higher on 10nm than TSMC on 7nm, so they are actually ahead if they manage to fix it
didn't research if this is true tho, just heard it + googled it
schmidtbag
We make fun of Intel's 14nm and all the +++ they add, but, it has very comparable performance to TSCM's 7nm. If Intel can pull off the same sort of refinement on 10nm, it will be better than we expect. The problem is, they're 3 years late.
sozuoka
While trashing on Intel is trending now, we always need competition in the market. And Intel can actually provide enough supply, so I do hope they can come up with good products soon.
Loobyluggs
That video....omfg....I can't even....
H83
Don´t tell me you don´t believe the guys from Intel just because they lied a few times about this...
For me that´s not even the best part. Their 14nm process is so refined by now that using it is basically like printing money. The 14nm process must be the most profitable in the history of semiconductors by far!
The only "downside" is that a big chunk of the profits are being burned on their failed 10nm process...
schmidtbag
It's even more profitable when you consider how little engineering Intel has done to their 14nm CPUs. AVX512 the most work they've done, and although it isn't minimal, it didn't come with an architecture refresh.
Even during Intel's worst years, they still rake in more cash than they know what to do with. Their net profits are stupidly huge, so although they have burned a lot on 10nm, it's not really much of a loss.
mackintosh
Exactly. It would take years of blunders and mismanagement to topple Chipzilla. Like any other corporate behemoth they take a while to change course, but it won't take them long to catch up and overtake again. That said, it's fun to take pot shots at them, so let's enjoy it while we can.
kendoka15
If we're comparing nodes, then we're not comparing actual performance as a LOT of it is tied to the architecture, as we've seen recently. Intel has only made gains of a few hundred Mhz in recent years, yet they've made much larger gains in overall performance. The nodes aren't comparable, but the different approaches (monolithic vs chiplets, low latency vs more cache, etc) of both companies have resulted in similarly performing products, at least in the metric of absolute performance.
The Radeon 7 is a great example of how a great node can underperform massively and why nodes don't mean anything by themselves. They can point to what's possible, but I don't think saying Intel's 14nm performs similarly to 7nm is objectively true.
Kevin Mauro
It's not bad news. *and this is public knowledge* nothing which isn't already known... these terms "nm" etc not in all cases but have often been obfuscated by marketing departments, the finer points - in essence, AMD's (Qualcomm, GoFlo etc, whom ever for that matter) hmm you know what one moment I shall link a known good source instead such as a news article...
10nm, 7nm, 5nm…. Should the Chip Nanometer Metric Be Replaced? (hpcwire.com)
Do nanometers matter? (fudzilla.com)
What Do “7nm” and “10nm” Mean for CPUs, and Why Do They Matter? (howtogeek.com)
Intel: The Nanometer Games (NASDAQ:INTC) | Seeking Alpha
Intel 14 nm Node Compared to TSMC's 7 nm Node Using Scanning Electron Microscope | TechPowerUp
"TSMC's node is still much denser compared to Intel's 14nm - TSMC's 7 nm produces chips with a transistor density around 90 MT/mm² (million transistors per square millimeter), which is comparable in density to Intel's 10 nm node used on recent mobile processors."
cucaulay malkin
there is a big upside to intel's 14nm+
Spoiler: "gaming"
Venix
Performance per core intel does fine. Power consumption is where they loose by a huge margin obviously 10nm will help em with consumption big time. Now the 10nm for intel is really late to the party , what remains to be seen is how fast intel can nail their 7 nm , did they get valuable knowledge from all the problems of 10nm ? Or scaling down to 7 is a beast of it's own ?
Silva
What I've learned from this video is that there's too many people that does not know how to use a face mask.
Is that why 10nm is having issues?
moo100times
I do wonder how true it is considering intel's line up on the consumer side remains mostly 14nm for the time being.
The lack of a current 6-8 core tiger lake just adds to the question. If its bugs have been ironed out, I would have hoped that an 8 core cpu would be a feasable product.
cucaulay malkin
doubling what could have been 10-20% of manufacturing capacity they need is still not gonna cut it.
tunejunky
Intel has massive capacity, period.
it does not need to do anything more than keep marketing out of engineering (source of 1/3 their issues), and by marketing i mean the executive suite which is overflowing with marketing types.
the Hillsboro, OR 10nm fab is twice the size of the original TSMC 7nm fab, and they have two other 10nm fabs (another in US, one in Israel).
they will catch up relatively fast on clock speeds and ipc, power draw is and will continue to be a weakness until they go to a sub 10nm node or new uArch or both.
what gets lost is the fact that the 10nm mobile cpu has been a huge success, defined by numbers shipped and laptops on the market. i'm writing this on one now.
tunejunky
they could, but they won't.
Intel's business plan includes fabbing their own product. they have spent more than the annual GDP of many small nations on fabs, to make a finer point they have spent more on fabs than AMD's gross profit until two years ago. as this is a business they need to show a return on their investments.
