Elon Musk Develops? Seriously? I mean seriously? Not Tesla R&D?

If people want solar panels and electric cars to be a true replacement, then wait for the graphene solution which is still probably 5 years away! A Canadian company has already made progress here, SunVault Energy, with electric cars that use graphene supercapacitors that can charge in five minutes! That's a way better alternative than what Tesla R&D are doing with still Lithium based batteries for cars. Also when it comes to solar panels, even if they become extremely efficient you need a better way to store excess electricity for when the sun isn't available and that again is where graphene can be the solution!

Spanish made cells can do +30%, sharp as panels going up to 40%, and the german Frauenhofer institute goes up to 46% efficiency... but sure, if TESLA is doing something, half the performance and its a "game changer"??

Spanish made cells can do +30%, sharp as panels going up to 40%, and the german Frauenhofer institute goes up to 46% efficiency... but sure, if TESLA is doing something, half the performance and its a "game changer"??

I was thinking about that as I read it too. A good friend of mine lives off grid and has a number of 40% efficient (but very expensive) panels too. I am guessing the key word here is mass manufactured to such scale...

Agreed, these must be very reasonably priced quality products knowing Elon's way to do things.

doubt it. just going thru numbers: they gained ~.5% and lowered cost by 20c. the 35-40% panels are almost twice as efficient, so as long as they are not twice as expensive, "i" still gain using them.

I wonder some exactly what that 20c is cheaper than... and for whom? Though I try to avoid buying product from China where possible, it's hard to argue (when on a very restricted budget) with 20% efficient panels producing 300watts that only cost £90 / USD$136 each (min order 10 though) If you have the space for them, its a virtually unbeatable deal for the consumer. When I heard him talk (some time back) about how Incredibly Cheap solar panels were about to become, coming down to virtually the cost of raw materials, I thought he really meant it. 20c drop in cost is not that for sure... not for the consumer at any rate.

doubt it. just going thru numbers: they gained ~.5% and lowered cost by 20c. the 35-40% panels are almost twice as efficient, so as long as they are not twice as expensive, "i" still gain using them.

May you cite your sources? Usual commercially available solar cells, small or large have 15~19% efficiency, expensive ones go bit over 20%. Some companies state 25% (and often state that they ore ones with 40% higher efficiency than standard 15~19% ones). While there are laboratory confirmed cells which have up to 46% efficiency, those are not commercially available. Being multi layer solar cells puts their price quite high. And often efficiency measurement is done using fresnel lenses. (apparently your roof installation will not have such addition if even for safety) And guys, please note that this price reduction is per Watt not per 200W cell.

I think it's time to take away the taxpayer subsidies for both the manufacturing and purchasing of solar (as well as electric cars) and let the market will decide their fate. As someone who lives in Southern California, the land of $60k+ tesla's, $30k solar arrays, and other high priced luxuries, it really disgusts me that the average Joe making $35-$45k per year has to pay higher taxes just so people making $100k+ can get many thousands of dollars off purchasing these things so they can show their friends how environmentally friendly they are. why? Because having the Government pick winners and losers is not capitalism, it's Corporatism... and it's highly corrupt by nature. Whenever a company (or a sector) receives tons of taxpayer funded subsidies it gives an unfair advantage which causes investors to flee their competitors. Companies who receive the taxpayer funded subsidies then have an incentive to give lots of money to politicians who support the handouts they're receiving, and so begins the same corrupt cycle you find with public and private sector unions, defense contractors, all green energy companies, the farm industry and since 2010... health care providers. This illustrates my point quite well: 80% of all green-energy loans went to Obama donors. This circle of corruption all across the economy is what's bankrupting the country.

I think it's time to take away the taxpayer subsidies for both the manufacturing and purchasing of solar (as well as electric cars) and let the market will decide their fate. As someone who lives in Southern California, the land of $60k+ tesla's, $30k solar arrays, and other high priced luxuries, it really disgusts me that the average Joe making $35-$45k per year has to pay higher taxes just so people making $100k+ can get many thousands of dollars off purchasing these things so they can show their friends how environmentally friendly they are. why? Because having the Government pick winners and losers is not capitalism, it's Corporatism... and it's highly corrupt by nature. Whenever a company (or a sector) receives tons of taxpayer funded subsidies it gives an unfair advantage which causes investors to flee their competitors. Companies who receive the taxpayer funded subsidies then have an incentive to give lots of money to politicians who support the handouts they're receiving, and so begins the same corrupt cycle you find with public and private sector unions, defense contractors, all green energy companies, the farm industry and since 2010... health care providers. This illustrates my point quite well: 80% of all green-energy loans went to Obama donors. This circle of corruption all across the economy is what's bankrupting the country.

Depends on the industry. If electric cars like Tesla wasn't subsidized the company wouldn't exist today and many of the electric cars designed by other companies to compete with Tesla also wouldn't exist. Should the Subsidizes eventually end? Absolutely. I think the government and people should keep an eye on that, because as you said -- in some industries they've gone on far too long. But for electric cars I think it's fine as is. By 2020 it should be ended though. The corruption part is a whole different problem and should be viewed as such.

@Fox2232 no mentioning in the article that its about commercially available panels. most panels with top output are from companies like sharp or a spanish uni as i remember. and dont assume the same "conditions" for homes outside the US. e.g. europe doesnt allows houses to be made of wood (exceptions are countrys like switzerland, but they use complete logs), like over here, so houses/roofs support much higher weight than here. and you can always install it on the ground given the space, especially when it comes to farmers or hill sides that dont allow for "construction".