gtx 880 could get 25 fps in all games and still run smooth with out input lag and page teareing when using gsync.

Not really. Maybe lesser input lag, but tearing will persist. At that low of an fps, G-Sync support depends on the monitor's minimum refresh rate, which I doubt many of them will have it lower than 30Hz. G-Sync won't be effective at 25fps if the monitor can only support 30Hz and up. Tearing will still be there in that case since the monitor won't go any lower than 30Hz to match the fps.

Nvidia have been doing low level API stuff for years and years, I just don't see how Mantle will be a game changer.. the consoles wont use it and why would they use it on PC where most people have Nvidia cards?

Just like amd/ati have... This is the first time since forever anyone has brought out a proper close to metal API...

nvidia could bomb maxwell (like thats gonna happen lmao) and still **** all over amd... gtx 880 could get 25 fps in all games and still run smooth with out input lag and page teareing when using gsync. Unless they make gsync available to amd its pointless to buy amd cards...

This came to mind whilst reading your post.

I cannot wait for performance info/reviews of a Maxwell gpu. I would love to see what the architecture can do. Even if its of "mid" range ones since the consensus it they will be released first. Also I cannot wait to see a definite Mantle review or benchmark/results other than from AMD or whatever and besides BF4. Everyone is going bonkers about, saying its the next best thing and defending it with a "Patronus Charm" while no one has ever used it. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ E.g: "That car is the best car ever! They said 0-60: 2sec, 200mph and 500MPG!" But its not even released yet and no one has even driven/drive test it yet!! "Yeah but the company showed it and they drove it very briefly on a controlled environment of theirs!" Oh ok. I will wait until its been released and people drive test it. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Not bashing anyone here btw. But does anyone wonder why Mantle it went so quite the last couple months? Where are some charts? Some performance info? Its not like its a secret or a GPU release under NDA or something. Maybe AMD saw that people are OVER-hyping it and they will be disappointed if Mantle isn't what people are expecting because of the hype. I seriously hope AMD can deliver and is indeed an amazing step with that lower level, closer to the metal API. I would love to see it and what it can do and if its that good I will go bonkers too about it. Until then I would advice all those that do the above to chill down and stop letting the PR guys messing with their heads. But, I guess the PR guys are really doing a good job. 😉

Everyone is going bonkers about, saying its the next best thing and defending it with a "Patronus Charm" while no one has ever used it.

Funny you should say that, because I'm seeing just as many people (if not more) claiming it'll bomb/is worthless/has no support. There's a lot of questionable posts in this thread tbh. There's also a saying about pots and kettles.

Funny you should say that, because I'm seeing just as many people (if not more) claiming it'll bomb/is worthless/has no support. There's a lot of questionable posts in this thread tbh. There's also a saying about pots and kettles.

That's true. But I wont even be troubled with those. I try to avoid getting involved in bitter/hate comments/conversations. They outcome is almost never good. But they are equally if not more "guilty" with the "claiming it'll bomb/is worthless/has no support" when for once more, the tech is not even out yet and its not tested/proven and its still in early stages. Everyone can do whatever they please, can argue for a whole week straight if they wish. Its their opinion and life/time. I have not right to tell anyone to do anything, other than some advices and my opinion, which like them I have every right to express it as they do. :thumbup:

That's true. But I wont even be troubled with those. I try to avoid getting involved in bitter/hate comments/conversations. They outcome is almost never good. But they are equally if not more "guilty" with the "claiming it'll bomb/is worthless/has no support" when for once more, the tech is not even out yet and its not tested/proven and its still in early stages. Everyone can do whatever they please, can argue for a whole week straight if they wish. Its their opinion and life/time. I have not right to tell anyone to do anything, other than some advices and my opinion, which like them I have every right to express it as they do. :thumbup:

It's one of those cases where we're going to see a lot of crap from both sides sadly, and we probably will once it launches no matter how it turns out. Granted I'd like to see a launch and some real numbers, but the reasoning for it being late is up in the air. I'll hold final judgement until it does launch.

It's one of those cases where we're going to see a lot of crap from both sides sadly, and we probably will once it launches no matter how it turns out. Granted I'd like to see a launch and some real numbers, but the reasoning for it being late is up in the air. I'll hold final judgement until it does launch.

:thumbup: Well said. I'm glad and it's nice to see that we still have some sensible members around here to balance out all this "craziness". 😉

I just had to register and post after reading this thread. First, after decades of us chasing frames per second increases, overclocking to eek out that last bit of performance, loading hacked firmware to emulate or unlock additional threads/cores, mantle which claims to give a respectable bump on frame rate is being discounted as not very important or not as valuable as g-sync? Huh? I want both but mantle is surely not insignificant. I have also read that it is untested, unproven, gone silent, won't be on consoles, etc as if these are definitive statements that are based in fact. I can't prove or disprove just like anyone else here. However, here is a tekzilla CES video that has a developer that actually shows the performance increase which made me all excited and wet in the nether regions: worldsfactory.net/2014/01/12/oxide-nitrous-engine-ported-to-mantle-in-two-months Personally I am not that affected or bothered by tearing but I know others are so I appreciate it. Given the two technologies, I would prefer to have both on a single card, but I chose frames per second bump anyday. If I can jack up my settings, run at 4k with an affordable card, get a slight edge in an FPS game, reduce the heat and power consumption by not having more silicon, and get free (as in freed up) performance by working smarter not harder - count me in! Don't get me wrong, I love Nvidia and will have to think long and hard about this next generation of cards, but to blindly support G-Sync and discount mantle is pure fanboy actions. We all love increases in performance and like it or not Mantle is going to give us that according to their statements, others who have witnessed it, and developers who are implementing it.

From what has been posted on teh Web, Mantle is delayed due to BF4. BF4 devs have stopped Mantle work, to get all of the Major BF4 Bugs fixed. Once BF4 is patched to how it should have been on release day, they'll get back to mantle work. The only reason I can see for all of the Other guys not releasing/Showing Mantle patches, is probably due to an exclusivity agreement/contract with BF4 to be the "Poster Child" of Mantle, and the First to release support for Mantle. If this is the case, then I would expect AMD to be modifying any futher agreements to include GTFO clauses when the Game isn't released on schedule, or is released on schedule, and is so buggy it needs heavily patching to be playable. Nobody wants to release a patch on an already buggy game, because how do you validate it, when you're not sure whats causing the bugs ? 🙂 I also can't wait for this Maxwell card to come out, just to see what Nvidias Next Gen is all about, as its supposedly even more efficient than the already efficient Kepler. And finally, I would like to know if Mantle will be compatible wih Hybrid PhysX for games like Star Citizen, which will apparently support both. I have a brand new GTS 650 1Gb just in case it is 🙂

Well, if BF4 misses the Mantle deadline we will have THIEF to test with in Feb. This game will launch with Mantle support.

Why's this thread turned into a mantle discussion?

Why's this thread turned into a mantle discussion?

cause as soon as mantle arrives it's bye bye NVidia, didn't you hear?

Why's this thread turned into a mantle discussion?

Who knows...

all nvidia threads seem to turn into a mantle discussion. Im used to it

cause as soon as mantle arrives it's bye bye NVidia, didn't you hear?

why is that, Mantle is open and nvidia can make a proper driver for it.. Its not strictly bound to GCN and nvidia's gpus have a very similar arch since Fermi days - AMD copied/mimicked allot so it shouldn't be that difficult, that extra ARM coop cpu by Maxwell will be a cherry on top (not in these early samples though) Im pretty sure they're already doing some homework on it. Back on topic; I wished they put a little stronger gpu out, this low-mid end is too low.. At least mid-high range card like GK104 would be much better 🤓

why is that, Mantle is open and nvidia can make a proper driver for it.. Its not strictly bound to GCN and nvidia's gpus have a very similar arch since Fermi days - AMD copied/mimicked allot so it shouldn't be that difficult, that extra ARM coop cpu by Maxwell will be a cherry on top (not in these early samples though) Im pretty sure they're already doing some homework on it. Back on topic; I wished they put a little stronger gpu out, this low-mid end is too low.. At least mid-high range card like GK104 would be much better 🤓

Think SLI was just being a bit sarcastic.

....

Back on topic; I wished they put a little stronger gpu out, this low-mid end is too low.. At least mid-high range card like GK104 would be much better 🤓

As 20nm does not seem ready yet I'm against higher end Maxwell debuting on 28nm.

As 20nm does not seem ready yet I'm against higher end Maxwell debuting on 28nm.

Have to agree, would like to see Maxwell at full potential. The good thing about seeing the 750Ti on 28nm though is how efficient Maxwell will be without the die-shrink.