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Guru3D.com » News » AMD GPU Design Seems to Leave Space for Future 3D V-Cache

AMD GPU Design Seems to Leave Space for Future 3D V-Cache

by Hilbert Hagedoorn on: 01/30/2023 09:47 AM | source: Tom Wassick (Twitter), Tom\'s Hardware | 7 comment(s)
AMD GPU Design Seems to Leave Space for Future 3D V-Cache

Tom Wassick, a semiconductor engineer, claims to have found traces of AMD's 3D V-Cache technology in the company's RX 7900 XT graphics processing unit (GPU). 

Wassick used infrared photography to examine the GPU die and discovered connection spots that resembled those in AMD's Zen 3 and Zen 4 architecture. Although it cannot be confirmed if these TSV connection points will be used for caching purposes, AMD has not announced any plans to expand its 3D packaging capabilities beyond vertically stacked cache. This leads to the speculation that the connection points may be intended to enhance gaming and/or compute performance with the use of a 3D cache. The discovery follows rumors of AMD incorporating 3D V-Cache tech into its GPUs.

AMD's 3D V-Cache technology for Ryzen and EPYC CPUs has proven a success. This technology increases L3 cache capacity by fusing an additional 64MB of cache onto the Ryzen or EPYC silicon. AMD has quadrupled the L3 cache on its Ryzen 9 7900X3D and 7950X3D processors and tripled it on its Ryzen 7 5800X3D and 7800X3D chips and EPYC Milan-X server CPUs. This has significantly improved the performance of programs that benefit from a larger cache. It is unknown how 3D V-Cache will function in a GPU, although theoretically, having more cache capacity may enable quicker processing of cache-sensitive tasks by lowering the number of trips to slower GDDR6 memory. However, AMD may encounter thermal concerns similar to those observed with Ryzen X3D CPUs, in which the additional cache hinders heat dissipation and causes CPU rates to decrease and temperatures to rise. AMD may need to reduce clock speeds to remedy this.



AMD GPU Design Seems to Leave Space for Future 3D V-Cache




« Quad-slot NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4090Ti/TITAN 800W graphics card / cooler caught on camera · AMD GPU Design Seems to Leave Space for Future 3D V-Cache · Nvidia Set to Unveil RTX 4060 and 4050 GPUs Ahead of Schedule? »

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Venix
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#6098035 Posted on: 01/30/2023 10:20 AM
I thought it was common knowledge that amd deemed the gains of 3stucking on 79xx GPUs as not worth the cost

Exodite
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Posts: 2087
Joined: 2006-09-28

#6098078 Posted on: 01/30/2023 01:50 PM
I thought it was common knowledge that amd deemed the gains of 3stucking on 79xx GPUs as not worth the cost

I don't know anything about that but this only seems to confirm the possibility exists.

Which makes sense to me, AMD would likely have designed the chips with the possibility in mind even if they don't end up making use of it.

Venix
Senior Member



Posts: 2986
Joined: 2016-08-01

#6098097 Posted on: 01/30/2023 02:46 PM
I don't know anything about that but this only seems to confirm the possibility exists.

Which makes sense to me, AMD would likely have designed the chips with the possibility in mind even if they don't end up making use of it.

There where talks that they tried vcache and they deemed the gains do not justify the cost, now why ? Only AMD knows , was that they had to operate on lower clocks so the gains where partly or completely negated ? The gains where trivial ? The yields are bad ? A combination of the above ? Only AMD knows

schmidtbag
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Posts: 7237
Joined: 2012-11-10

#6098122 Posted on: 01/30/2023 04:27 PM
There where talks that they tried vcache and they deemed the gains do not justify the cost, now why ? Only AMD knows , was that they had to operate on lower clocks so the gains where partly or completely negated ? The gains where trivial ? The yields are bad ? A combination of the above ? Only AMD knows

I assume there was a performance gain but not enough to justify the additional price. Keep in mind, as much as AMD would like you to think otherwise, they're not the #1 brand, so it doesn't make sense for them to cut into their profit margins only to still be bested by Nvidia.
From what I can tell, the RDNA architecture isn't as starved for memory bandwidth as GCN. When you then account for DirectStorage, higher PCIe bandwidth, and high-speed VRAM becoming more affordable, I could see how V-cache might not be necessary; just simply having bigger caches was enough, apparently.

Venix
Senior Member



Posts: 2986
Joined: 2016-08-01

#6098136 Posted on: 01/30/2023 05:29 PM
I assume there was a performance gain but not enough to justify the additional price. Keep in mind, as much as AMD would like you to think otherwise, they're not the #1 brand, so it doesn't make sense for them to cut into their profit margins only to still be bested by Nvidia.
From what I can tell, the RDNA architecture isn't as starved for memory bandwidth as GCN. When you then account for DirectStorage, higher PCIe bandwidth, and high-speed VRAM becoming more affordable, I could see how V-cache might not be necessary; just simply having bigger caches was enough, apparently.

Cache is still very important see how much more cache the 4xxx cards have in comparison to ampere ! Hell it seems the biggest change is the increased cache at least in the die allocation. AMD already took the cache out on the small chiplets so they do not occupy space on the main die keeping it smaller for better yields and as a result cheaper.

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