I grabbed my 5700 XT for $390. I feel like that's the same pricing that would be "reasonable" here again. Not that AMD will sell these for $390. I'd say $450.

buhehe:

I think that, unless there's a cartel from AMD and Nvidia, there's nothing inherently wrong with what they're doing. If people are willing to pay more money for their products, they'd be fools not to accept it.

U see, u are talking like a pro businessman. But i comfortably prefer to think like a value concerned customer. 🙂 So, yes, if the price of a product segment which we budget oriented customers are mostly concerned about gets a sizable bump, we will complain.

Since there's no actual stock of all these cards then price will always remain high. It's only when they over stock and cards start piling up on shelves that they start having sales and money offs. Don't expect prices to get better any time soon. Some are saying 6 months before even pre-orders will be cleared.

wavetrex:

Thank just the fanboys. Nothing is Nvidia's fault, they are a business and they are doing that business accordingly. If they would charge $10000 for a GPU and people would still buy them, then they are doing the business exactly as they should.

And it's up to the customers to correct (or to encourage) them with their wallets.

DannyD:

bla bla bla

Ok so here one for you, it's just silly and completely compulsive to buy a GPU only for gaming in 2020, a console is a way wiser choice even for those who aren't deprived money wise. And don't give me craps like "everyone are free to do whatever with their money", by such nonsensical way of spending money you are affecting those who are less fortunate than you.

TieSKey:

Nvidia had similar prices back then. Also a "cheapo" architecture? Actually, how do u make a "cheap" architecture at all?? or were those chips 1/2 the physical size of a nv3060/rx6700?? How comes the top 2 GPU companies in the world have not made any performance/price improvement in the 100-300 price bracket for the last 3 years, but they did in the 800-1000 one? "Moore's law" is crying in its grave (cuz lets face it, it died 10 years ago).

Simple answer: Minors They reversed time flow for performance per $ for some time. And companies decided not to catch up for profit. And as for Moore Law. Ask TSMC/GloFo/Samsung/Intel if their transistors are becoming cheaper at rate ML predicted. Answer is probably: Yes. But real world is driven by supply and demand. => Very high demand. => High prices. Would you remove Minors from image, Gamers and normal users would historically be able to buy GPUs cheaper. (availability) Which would result in them buying better GPUs at time. And have smaller need to upgrade later. This decreased demand in contrast to actual events would lead to lower prices overall. Because even demand on forges would be smaller. In reality, people who needed GPU in those times paid twice as much as before Minor's craze for same performance. I remember shops here selling RX 580 8GB for $450 without VAT.

thesebastian:

If the 6700 or 6700 XT have VRM on the right side and NXZT Kraken G12 support them, then I'll upgrade to this GPU instead of the RX 6800 (or RTX 3070) and not because of the price. Current 2020 GPUs don't seem to support this. My priority is to upgrade my GTX1080 without sacrificing silence. (my current gpu does 19.2 db(A) in full load and I don't want to increase this noise). Second priority is max TDP and price of the card.

6700XT at around 2.3GHz will be at best around 50% faster than your card if you did not OC. And likely will deliver best performance per $ on 1080p. And on higher resolutions, memory bandwidth will result in sharper decline in performance than RX 6800(XT) has. = = = = Side note: @Hilbert Hagedoorn : Would you kindly (if possible) downclock memory on RX 6800XT and see how much it affects performance on 1080p/1440p/4K? To see how progressive is performance drop in percent. Like 3%/6%/11% on 1080p/1440p/4K. It is purely to see where IC does its job and how it is being used.

Halulam:

So now an 350 - 500 $ cards are for casual gamers and console level graphics ? Sad, really sad.

i remember when i get a GTX 590 at 500 Euro, it was so madly expensive for a top high end GPU... At one point they should think that in rich country, most people gain around 1100 Euro by month, and in some developed country a surgery medic still earn around 600 Euro by month... But those price are global and too high...

Halulam:

the right price ? is to not pay the same price as a whole console package for only the video card, consoles that can play games with the same quality as those 500€ "mid range".

You're free not to buy it... also, consoles are sold at a loss, making all the profit through highly priced games, services and peripherals. It's a fairly poor comparison, different business models.

mohiuddin:

U see, u are talking like a pro businessman. But i comfortably prefer to think like a value concerned customer. 🙂 So, yes, if the price of a product segment which we budget oriented customers are mostly concerned about gets a sizable bump, we will complain.

I am not a businessman, but a concerned customer too - I'm still on my R9 290 / 4690K, running for over 6 years... but at the same time I can't ignore how the markets work. There's a ton of demand and low supply, so price will go up. It sucks but it's the way it is. Besides, we're not talking about necessities such as food, water, medicines that we consider a right that, therefore, must be accessible to all. AMD and Nvidia's aim is solely to generate more profit and make shareholders happy. They never cared about us in the first place. When they claim to do things "for gamers" is to create fanboyism and feed the hivemind.

Fox2232:

But real world is driven by supply and demand. => Very high demand. => High prices.

Oh come on, u know better than this..... the world is driven by the 2% who control 60% of the supply chains and have a great influence in the demand. But even if u don't see the above statement as I do, u will have to agree that a duopoly doesn't respond to demand and supply """rules""" (don't take my word for it, go check any book on capitalism theory/math). Oh u mean miners, yeah that was the turning point. But I don't think it has to be with supply and demand but rather NVidia/AMD realized the greater profitability of the paragraph below, the miner's craze just "forced" them into this level of prices at the same time, working as an implicit agreement to "keep" them. (not that would be hard for any of them to raise the phone and call the other.... aren't the CEOs actually related or something?? xD) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- It isn't about what "customers" as a whole are willing to pay. It is simply more profitable to sell the new cards for 1k (I dare to say at 75% profit margin) to the 10% of the global population that can afford them and leave old tech to the rest (that isn't terrible cheap either considering the new console generation will move up the avg performance needed for games)

TieSKey:

Oh come on, u know better than this..... the world is driven by the 2% who control 60% of the supply chains and have a great influence in the demand. But even if u don't see the above statement as I do, u will have to agree that a duopoly doesn't respond to demand and supply """rules""" (don't take my word for it, go check any book on capitalism theory/math). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- It isn't about what "customers" as a whole are willing to pay. It is simply more profitable to sell the new cards for 1k (I dare to say at 75% profit margin) to the 10% of the global population that can afford them and leave old tech to the rest (that isn't terrible cheap either considering the new console generation will move up the avg performance needed for games)

Proof is in the pudding. And you can't have your 3080 as well as I can't have my 6800XT. They are not really around because they are so great that everyone wants them. Reason why they are not around is that Samsung does not produce enough chips for nVidia and TSMC does not produce enough chips for AMD. Inflated prices you see in some shops, no extra money for AIB partners, no extra money for AMD/nVidia. No extra money for TSMC/Samsung. If forges could get more GPUs out, they would make proportionally more money. But they are at their capacity. There is no artificial shortage. nVidia did not have to reduce pricing and people would still buy out everything. AMD would follow nVidia's pricing same way as they did follow it. Would nVidia's cards came at 20% higher price, AMD would be at that price points -$50 as they are now. And cards would still end up being sold out. World is large and demand is large. If people stop buying for some time, prices would go down. But that's not going to happen, not now with virus around. People are home, saved money by not doing extra traveling. By not having extra winter activities and paying for luxury hotels. And so they have to find hobbies they can do from home. There is race between MS and Sony. Who can get more devices to hands of people. If TSMC had any spare capacity, they would fight over it. As for economic part with quite high profit margins. You are right. Last time I did check nVidia's numbers, they could have drop price at which they sell GPUs to AIBs to 1/2 and still make huge profit. At any given point, they could have put AMD's GPU division out of business, as AMD had almost no space for price war due to lower sales volume. That's main reason why nVidia was not pressed to reduce prices. Destroying only real competition and having monopoly? Not worth it. - - - - And root cause which cumulated into current situation would likely need fishbone diagram. But: - Minors (Responsible for unsatisfied demand in past. People blowing budget on weaker GPUs. => People needing upgrade.) - Multiple technology refreshes at same time. (Forges can't keep up with demand.) - Virus (Increasing demand for entertainment. And a lot of people who did not spend money through the year.) - Xmas (Usual seasonal contributor.)

thesebastian:

If the 6700 or 6700 XT have VRM on the right side and NXZT Kraken G12 support them, then I'll upgrade to this GPU instead of the RX 6800 (or RTX 3070) and not because of the price. Current 2020 GPUs don't seem to support this. My priority is to upgrade my GTX1080 without sacrificing silence. (my current gpu does 19.2 db(A) in full load and I don't want to increase this noise). Second priority is max TDP and price of the card.

I'm also a quiet nut. I have been hoping to see some reviews of 6800 or 6800 XT's with the quiet driver mode on. Especially the beafy cards like the red devil etc.

Fox2232:

If forges could get more GPUs out, they would make proportionally more money. But they are at their capacity. There is no artificial shortage. nVidia did not have to reduce pricing and people would still buy out everything. AMD would follow nVidia's pricing same way as they did follow it.

Updated my previous post a little probably while u were typing. I'm talking about MSRP, forge capacity and actual/real demand (which none of us know) affect prices only starting from the MSRP price the duopoly sets at their desired profitability point. And MSRP almost never goes down with time. U can get lower than msrp prices sometimes on really old tech or special offers but that's it. The card from this topic has not even been announced, it probably won't be available earlier than feb/march. I really hope for AMD to sell this for 250 and make me look like a stupid but I really doubt it.

buhehe:

You're free not to buy it... also, consoles are sold at a loss, making all the profit through highly priced games, services and peripherals. It's a fairly poor comparison, different business models.

Yea everyone is free to do whatever they want until it start affecting you and your purchasing power, because yes as I said we live in society and a complex economy that are tightly linked, if the majority start to consume foolishly and selfishly we might as well reach a point of no return, I mean people rolling on debts because "hobbies" and the reasonable one's paying the bills with them... And I don't see any major differences in price of AAA or even some big indies games between consoles and PC, and by the way don't forget the price of other parts that can perfectly pay for years of Xbox game pass or other similar services.

Halulam:

Yea everyone is free to do whatever they want until it start affecting you and your purchasing power, because yes as I said we live in society and a complex economy that are tightly linked, if the majority start to consume foolishly and selfishly we might as well reach a point of no return, I mean people rolling on debts because "hobbies" and the reasonable one's paying the bills with them... And I don't see any major differences in price of AAA or even some big indies games between consoles and PC, and by the way don't forget the price of other parts that can perfectly pay for years of Xbox game pass or other similar services.

Do you want companies to lower prices because they are supposed to love you? Your purchasing power is your own problem

this card will be a winner. the change in process and uArch will lead to + 20% - ish performance jump, with 12gb vram you can run any game at max eye candy 1080p and pretty well at 1440p.... which is where the lions share of the market still is. Nvidia is going to go with (imho) an Ampere( or 8nm variant) 1660ti refresh which would save a lot of money and cost Nvidia very little

Halulam:

.. Ok so here one for you, it's just silly and completely compulsive to buy a GPU only for gaming in 2020, a console is a way wiser choice even for those who aren't deprived money wise. ...

I disagree, with a console the games are ridiculously priced less you wait a year, with a pc if you want you got free games free movies free music basically the world at your fingertips, how does that compare to someone broke with a controller in their hand? That someone could do online surveys and earn some money for a new gpu with their pc.

tunejunky:

this card will be a winner. the change in process and uArch will lead to + 20% - ish performance jump, with 12gb vram you can run any game at max eye candy 1080p and pretty well at 1440p.... which is where the lions share of the market still is. Nvidia is going to go with (imho) an Ampere( or 8nm variant) 1660ti refresh which would save a lot of money and cost Nvidia very little

3060ti and 6700xt it will be a good midrange battle between the two. Again amd card more vram and nvidia card better raytracing performance and dlss. By then im sure amd will have super resolution to even the odds.

buhehe:

I am not a businessman, but a concerned customer too - I'm still on my R9 290 / 4690K, running for over 6 years... but at the same time I can't ignore how the markets work. There's a ton of demand and low supply, so price will go up. It sucks but it's the way it is. Besides, we're not talking about necessities such as food, water, medicines that we consider a right that, therefore, must be accessible to all. AMD and Nvidia's aim is solely to generate more profit and make shareholders happy. They never cared about us in the first place. When they claim to do things "for gamers" is to create fanboyism and feed the hivemind.

Common ground. Same feeling bro. Same. Although my upgrade path should be a little less complex than yours as i am using x470 board. But u and me both have similarly performing gfx card. Mine is 980ti Even though i get pretty bad itches of upgrade every now and then, the urge is being strongly mitigated by the things that u have just mentioned . May be at the end of 2021 i might get some upgrades.

DannyD:

I disagree, with a console the games are ridiculously priced less you wait a year, with a pc if you want you got free games free movies free music basically the world at your fingertips, how does that compare to someone broke with a controller in their hand? That someone could do online surveys and earn some money for a new gpu with their pc.

To be fair. Unless someone is compulsive game buyer, we on PC pay more. Because to play games we need HW. And if you want to play that game at high details day it is released... And we pay for playing way we want to play. Each has its benefits and downsides. Would MS give XSX Windows 10 mode/boot ability... You would see what would happen. But they do not need those sales.

It will be REALLY interesting what happens in laptops. Will highly improved perf/W be enough for AMD to penetrate the Nvidia's fortress which is mobile? Will branding and ecosystem be enough to hold the barbarians at the gate 😀