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Intel ends Tick-Tock cycle and delays 10nm production to 2017
Intel delays their 10nm Cannonlake products towards 2017, instead next year Intel will introduce Kabylake processors, and these are third gen 14nm product series. This effectively puts a halt towards Intel's Tick-Tock product release cycle.
Intel's Brian Krzanich reported this news in a presentation about the quarter results. See, "Tick-Tock" is a model used by chip manufacturer Intel Corporation from 2007 to follow every micro-architectural change with a die shrink of the process technology. Moore's Law has been proven to become more and more difficult, and that now shows.
Every "tick" represents a shrinked process technology based on the previous micro-architecture (sometimes introducing new things like instructions, as with Broadwell, released in late 2014) and every "tock" designates a new micro-architecture. Roughly every year to 18 months, there is expected to be one tick or tock. Haswell (22nm Tock, LGA-2011, high-end), Broadwell (14nm Tick, LGA-1150, mainstream) and Skylake (14nm Tock, LGA-1150, mainstream).
| Microarchitecture | CPU series | Tick or Tock | Fab node | Year Released |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Presler/Cedar Mill | Pentium 4 / D | Tick | 65 nm | 2006 |
| Conroe/Merom | Core 2 Duo/Quad | Tock | 65 nm | 2006 |
| Penryn | Core 2 Duo/Quad | Tick | 45 nm | 2007 |
| Nehalem | Core i | Tock | 45 nm | 2008 |
| Westmere | Core i | Tick | 32 nm | 2010 |
| Sandy Bridge | Core i 2xxx | Tock | 32 nm | 2011 |
| Ivy Bridge | Core i 3xxx | Tick | 22 nm | 2012 |
| Haswell | Core i 4xxx | Tock | 22 nm | 2013 |
| Broadwell | Core i 5xxx | Tick | 14 nm | 2014 & 2015 for desktops |
| Skylake | Core i 6xxx | Tock | 14 nm | 2015 |
| Kabylake | Core i 7xxx | Tock | 14 nm | 2016 |
| Cannonlake | Core i 8xxx? | Tick | 10 nm | 2017 |
Intel will start rolling out its 14nm "Skylake" processors this autumn, the 10nm "Cannonlake" chips were to be the follow-up. However as it is known now, Intel will release Kaby lake in the 2nd half of 2016. Kaby lake will be based on Skylake and will offer better performance. Effectively this means we will see three families of 14nm Intel chips: Broadwell from 2014, Skylake in 2015, and Kaby Lake in late 2016. The 10nm Cannonlake parts will follow in 2017.
The 10nm products under codename Cannonlake will be relased 2nd half of 2017. Krzanich confirmed that the first Skylake parts are on-schedule for production in the second half of this year, but did not confirm a firm launch date.
Matt26LFC
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#5123411 Posted on: 07/16/2015 05:57 PM
Well like this wasn't obvious. Which is basically why I'm going to get on skylake now, nothing is coming for at least the next 2 years thats going to be interesting. It won't be until 10nm Canonlake arrives, and even then Canonlake is mostly just a die shrink of Skylake. Could be 2018 and 10nm with a whole new Architecture before we see something amazing for CPUs in the Desktop space.
At least Z170 chipset will have all the latest features etc Only thing I could think that might be missing from Z170 Platform is PCIe 4.0, perhaps that'll be a feature that Intel use to sell Kaby Lake when it arrives next year, PCIe 4.0 for the mainstream, but limit it to 16 lanes so's not to undercut Skylake-E sales.
Well like this wasn't obvious. Which is basically why I'm going to get on skylake now, nothing is coming for at least the next 2 years thats going to be interesting. It won't be until 10nm Canonlake arrives, and even then Canonlake is mostly just a die shrink of Skylake. Could be 2018 and 10nm with a whole new Architecture before we see something amazing for CPUs in the Desktop space.
At least Z170 chipset will have all the latest features etc Only thing I could think that might be missing from Z170 Platform is PCIe 4.0, perhaps that'll be a feature that Intel use to sell Kaby Lake when it arrives next year, PCIe 4.0 for the mainstream, but limit it to 16 lanes so's not to undercut Skylake-E sales.
Denial
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#5123413 Posted on: 07/16/2015 06:02 PM
Well like this wasn't obvious. Which is basically why I'm going to get on skylake now, nothing is coming for at least the next 2 years thats going to be interesting. It won't be until 10nm Canonlake arrives, and even then Canonlake is mostly just a die shrink of Skylake. Could be 2018 and 10nm with a whole new Architecture before we see something amazing for CPUs in the Desktop space.
At least Z170 chipset will have all the latest features etc Only thing I could think that might be missing from Z170 Platform is PCIe 4.0, perhaps that'll be a feature that Intel use to sell Kaby Lake when it arrives next year, PCIe 4.0 for the mainstream, but limit it to 16 lanes so's not to undercut Skylake-E sales.
From Anandtech:
The new processor family is being dubbed Kaby Lake. It will be based on the preceding Skylake micro-architecture but with key performance enhancements to differentiate it from Skylake and to offer a further generation of performance improvements in light of the delay of Intel’s 10nm process. Intel hasn’t gone into detail at this time over just what those enhancements will be for Kaby Lake, though we are curious over just how far in advance Intel has been planning for the new family.
Well like this wasn't obvious. Which is basically why I'm going to get on skylake now, nothing is coming for at least the next 2 years thats going to be interesting. It won't be until 10nm Canonlake arrives, and even then Canonlake is mostly just a die shrink of Skylake. Could be 2018 and 10nm with a whole new Architecture before we see something amazing for CPUs in the Desktop space.
At least Z170 chipset will have all the latest features etc Only thing I could think that might be missing from Z170 Platform is PCIe 4.0, perhaps that'll be a feature that Intel use to sell Kaby Lake when it arrives next year, PCIe 4.0 for the mainstream, but limit it to 16 lanes so's not to undercut Skylake-E sales.
From Anandtech:
The new processor family is being dubbed Kaby Lake. It will be based on the preceding Skylake micro-architecture but with key performance enhancements to differentiate it from Skylake and to offer a further generation of performance improvements in light of the delay of Intel’s 10nm process. Intel hasn’t gone into detail at this time over just what those enhancements will be for Kaby Lake, though we are curious over just how far in advance Intel has been planning for the new family.
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#5123415 Posted on: 07/16/2015 06:05 PM
Yes, "tick-tock" is like "Moore's Law," one of those generally understood truths that's false...
Yes, "tick-tock" is like "Moore's Law," one of those generally understood truths that's false...
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#5123436 Posted on: 07/16/2015 06:37 PM
sound like skylake will be what i going after then
sound like skylake will be what i going after then
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#5123437 Posted on: 07/16/2015 06:40 PM
Same here
sound like skylake will be what i going after then
Same here
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#5123470 Posted on: 07/16/2015 07:24 PM
....that proves it's not a trivial problem.
You get problems with quantum tunneling and other weird physics that only a few people in the world understand. So what happens when they get to 10 nm? 8 nm? 6 nm? Silicon chip atoms are ~0.2nm. We are running into physical limits.
Pretty crazy that a company with that much money and arguably the best engineers can't figure this out.
....that proves it's not a trivial problem.
You get problems with quantum tunneling and other weird physics that only a few people in the world understand. So what happens when they get to 10 nm? 8 nm? 6 nm? Silicon chip atoms are ~0.2nm. We are running into physical limits.
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#5123477 Posted on: 07/16/2015 07:37 PM
Intel liked so much what they gain with Devils Cannon that they want to repeat this trend with Kabylake, and milk us even more between real ticks and tocks.
Intel liked so much what they gain with Devils Cannon that they want to repeat this trend with Kabylake, and milk us even more between real ticks and tocks.
Denial
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#5123479 Posted on: 07/16/2015 07:40 PM
....that proves it's not a trivial problem.
You get problems with quantum tunneling and other weird physics that only a few people in the world understand. So what happens when they get to 10 nm? 8 nm? 6 nm? Silicon chip atoms are ~0.2nm. We are running into physical limits.
I don't really get the ... I know it's not a trivial problem. That's why I think it's crazy.
....that proves it's not a trivial problem.
You get problems with quantum tunneling and other weird physics that only a few people in the world understand. So what happens when they get to 10 nm? 8 nm? 6 nm? Silicon chip atoms are ~0.2nm. We are running into physical limits.
I don't really get the ... I know it's not a trivial problem. That's why I think it's crazy.
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#5123542 Posted on: 07/16/2015 09:34 PM
It was an absolute bitch for them to get on 14nm, let alone 10nm. 14nm is fine for a 3rd generation, as it will still have room for improvement.
They obviously need time for engineering, I'm sure they are considering many directions.
It was an absolute bitch for them to get on 14nm, let alone 10nm. 14nm is fine for a 3rd generation, as it will still have room for improvement.
They obviously need time for engineering, I'm sure they are considering many directions.
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#5123549 Posted on: 07/16/2015 09:45 PM
It's probably more like you can't reduce manufacturing costs and increase yields ATMIT and therefore doesn't make sense to progress.
Pretty crazy that a company with that much money and arguably the best engineers can't figure this out.
It's probably more like you can't reduce manufacturing costs and increase yields ATMIT and therefore doesn't make sense to progress.
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#5123699 Posted on: 07/17/2015 03:11 AM
IBM just made the first 7nm chip, so I doubt Intel needs more time for R&D.
I think it's just a delay since they're so far ahead of AMD. Why push things out the door when you can stretch technology out and make more money until AMD get a little closer, at least.
IBM just made the first 7nm chip, so I doubt Intel needs more time for R&D.
I think it's just a delay since they're so far ahead of AMD. Why push things out the door when you can stretch technology out and make more money until AMD get a little closer, at least.
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#5123701 Posted on: 07/17/2015 03:18 AM
IBM just made the first 7nm chip, so I doubt Intel needs more time for R&D.
I think it's just a delay since they're so far ahead of AMD. Why push things out the door when you can stretch technology out and make more money until AMD get a little closer, at least.
Exactly.. CannonLake was first made to be Z170 compatible, but now they decided it will have new chipset, more $$$$ this way. And for backwards compatibility they make some ripoff KabyLake, just so Z170 users won't be left out..
I really hope AMD Zen will kick Intels ass so they will stop with this ripoff, either release proper tock in same socket like in the past or don't bother with something half-made
IBM just made the first 7nm chip, so I doubt Intel needs more time for R&D.
I think it's just a delay since they're so far ahead of AMD. Why push things out the door when you can stretch technology out and make more money until AMD get a little closer, at least.
Exactly.. CannonLake was first made to be Z170 compatible, but now they decided it will have new chipset, more $$$$ this way. And for backwards compatibility they make some ripoff KabyLake, just so Z170 users won't be left out..
I really hope AMD Zen will kick Intels ass so they will stop with this ripoff, either release proper tock in same socket like in the past or don't bother with something half-made
Denial
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#5123706 Posted on: 07/17/2015 03:27 AM
IBM just made the first 7nm chip, so I doubt Intel needs more time for R&D.
I think it's just a delay since they're so far ahead of AMD. Why push things out the door when you can stretch technology out and make more money until AMD get a little closer, at least.
Exactly.. CannonLake was first made to be Z170 compatible, but now they decided it will have new chipset, more $$$$ this way. And for backwards compatibility they make some ripoff KabyLake, just so Z170 users won't be left out..
I really hope AMD Zen will kick Intels ass so they will stop with this ripoff, either release proper tock in same socket like in the past or don't bother with something half-made
Uh, Intel may be competing against AMD at the desktop level, but their focus has been on mobile for a few years now. They aren't competitive there yet and they definitely need die shrinks to become competitive. They definitely aren't holding back.
IBM just made the first 7nm chip, so I doubt Intel needs more time for R&D.
I think it's just a delay since they're so far ahead of AMD. Why push things out the door when you can stretch technology out and make more money until AMD get a little closer, at least.
Exactly.. CannonLake was first made to be Z170 compatible, but now they decided it will have new chipset, more $$$$ this way. And for backwards compatibility they make some ripoff KabyLake, just so Z170 users won't be left out..
I really hope AMD Zen will kick Intels ass so they will stop with this ripoff, either release proper tock in same socket like in the past or don't bother with something half-made
Uh, Intel may be competing against AMD at the desktop level, but their focus has been on mobile for a few years now. They aren't competitive there yet and they definitely need die shrinks to become competitive. They definitely aren't holding back.
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#5123711 Posted on: 07/17/2015 03:31 AM
Well I was only referring to desktop die shrinks, it looks like they're milking it to the max.. I agree on mobile part.
Well I was only referring to desktop die shrinks, it looks like they're milking it to the max.. I agree on mobile part.
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Bummer. Intel needs to get EUV up and going. Pretty crazy that a company with that much money and arguably the best engineers can't figure this out.