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Single-core performance of Intel's Sunny Cove chips Surface - Shows Big IPC Increase
Funny how these slides always seem to leak right after a competitor announcement ;) Anyhow, we're talking about Intel's new Sunny Cove architecture, which is still out for quite a while. Mind you that Sunny Cove is a four-core series proc baked at 10nm. Intel already made claims that it IPC improvements would be 18% and even 40% in some workloads.
That comparison is against Skylake by the way. Also, that info, however, is from Intel themselves, and in my lifetime I've seen manY official intel figures, and let's call them 'not always accurate'.
However now a list of single-core benchmarks (CPU-Z) has appeared on a Chinese forum for some Sunny Cove and Ryzen 3000 chips. Given that a Ryzen 2700X achieves a score of 488, we can state that (as far as these benchmarks are real) Ryzen 3000 does indeed entail serious IPC improvements. Intel is also doing very well because the benchmark shows that an i7 9700K achieves comparable results with one of the Sunny Cove chips at just 3.7 GHz. We are already adding our salt, but if it is true these figures are impressive.
You need to wonder though, how would an Asia website with an unknown forum member get access to unreleased processors from both sides with, apparently, full support of the procs in CPU-Z?
Salt, grain, lots of it.
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AMD is planning to phase out its single-core Sempron LE-1150 processor by the end of this month and will launch a higher-end Athlon LE-1660 for its single-core CPU lineup, according to sources at moth...
Fox2232
Senior Member
Posts: 9380
Joined: 2012-07-20
Senior Member
Posts: 9380
Joined: 2012-07-20
#5681439 Posted on: 06/17/2019 10:17 AM
I have no doubt in my mind that Intel will hit back hard when they are leaving the 14nm node soon.
I don't need anything tho. I have Ryzen 1700 @ 3 (underclocked and undervolted) in my server and 9900K @ 5.2 in my gaming rig. I would be surprised if Zen 2 is going to match 9900K - or even 8700K - in gaming anyway, especially CPU bound aka high fps gaming. Would be fun tho. I like competition.
Would be nice to see some competition in the GPU space now. Nvidia is dominating. Especially outside of low to mid-end market.
RTX 2060 "Super" and 2070 "Super" countered Navi 5700 and 5700 XT before they even released... Imagine if Nvidia really wanted to destroy AMD and put out 7nm now, instead of Turing refresh at 12nm again.
I need Ampere 7nm EUV before I buy anything.
I love your mindshare. Vaporware counters unreleased product.
One likely does not exist and you know very little, borderline nothing about other.
And then people are surprised that AMD does not play way they want them to.
I have no doubt in my mind that Intel will hit back hard when they are leaving the 14nm node soon.
I don't need anything tho. I have Ryzen 1700 @ 3 (underclocked and undervolted) in my server and 9900K @ 5.2 in my gaming rig. I would be surprised if Zen 2 is going to match 9900K - or even 8700K - in gaming anyway, especially CPU bound aka high fps gaming. Would be fun tho. I like competition.
Would be nice to see some competition in the GPU space now. Nvidia is dominating. Especially outside of low to mid-end market.
RTX 2060 "Super" and 2070 "Super" countered Navi 5700 and 5700 XT before they even released... Imagine if Nvidia really wanted to destroy AMD and put out 7nm now, instead of Turing refresh at 12nm again.
I need Ampere 7nm EUV before I buy anything.
I love your mindshare. Vaporware counters unreleased product.
One likely does not exist and you know very little, borderline nothing about other.
And then people are surprised that AMD does not play way they want them to.
cryohellinc
Senior Member
Posts: 2490
Joined: 2014-10-20
Senior Member
Posts: 2490
Joined: 2014-10-20
#5681441 Posted on: 06/17/2019 10:26 AM
Any shrink provides efficiency and performance gains. Intel has achieved a lot with their 14nm process, and I'm certain that 10nm and 7nm will provide great increases.
However, the main question here is - WHEN and at what price.
Any shrink provides efficiency and performance gains. Intel has achieved a lot with their 14nm process, and I'm certain that 10nm and 7nm will provide great increases.
However, the main question here is - WHEN and at what price.
Undying
Senior Member
Posts: 11240
Joined: 2008-08-28
Senior Member
Posts: 11240
Joined: 2008-08-28
#5681442 Posted on: 06/17/2019 10:30 AM
Intel must show something to slow down the zen2 hype. Release date and pricing unknown. Hah, most of us will already rock a ryzen cpus until these see the light of day.
Intel must show something to slow down the zen2 hype. Release date and pricing unknown. Hah, most of us will already rock a ryzen cpus until these see the light of day.
Andrew LB
Senior Member
Posts: 1019
Joined: 2012-05-22
Senior Member
Posts: 1019
Joined: 2012-05-22
#5681443 Posted on: 06/17/2019 10:34 AM
When was the last time Intels pre-release performance didn't match up with the final product? They have a far better record than AMD in this department, yet I can't recall you ever adding a disclaimer to news about their performance numbers. Come to think of it, i also don't recall you making product announcement articles from nV or Intel pinned at the top of the forum either. At least try and show a little objectivity
That comparison is against Skylake by the way. Also, that info, however, is from Intel themselves, and in my lifetime I've seen manY official intel figures, and let's call them 'not always accurate'.
When was the last time Intels pre-release performance didn't match up with the final product? They have a far better record than AMD in this department, yet I can't recall you ever adding a disclaimer to news about their performance numbers. Come to think of it, i also don't recall you making product announcement articles from nV or Intel pinned at the top of the forum either. At least try and show a little objectivity
Exodite
Senior Member
Posts: 1852
Joined: 2006-09-28
Senior Member
Posts: 1852
Joined: 2006-09-28
#5681444 Posted on: 06/17/2019 10:35 AM
While Hilbert already pointed out the need for salt it's probably important to drive home just how much is needed;
CPU-Z isn't a reliable benchmark. Even if these numbers ended up being correct it may not amount to anything.
At face value this puts Sunny Cove at a 44% higher IPC, compared to Coffe Lake refresh. That's not just similar to AMDs uplift going from Bulldozer to Zen, it's directly contradicting Intel's own (likely optimistic) claims.
I have no doubt Intel will have an answer to Zen 2 but I doubt it'll be as early as next year, and frankly I'd be very surprised to see another 40+% IPC uplift over a single generation on either x86 architecture. Aside from very narrow applications obviously, like another doubling of AVX throughput or dedicated instructions for en/decoding etc.
While Hilbert already pointed out the need for salt it's probably important to drive home just how much is needed;
CPU-Z isn't a reliable benchmark. Even if these numbers ended up being correct it may not amount to anything.
At face value this puts Sunny Cove at a 44% higher IPC, compared to Coffe Lake refresh. That's not just similar to AMDs uplift going from Bulldozer to Zen, it's directly contradicting Intel's own (likely optimistic) claims.
I have no doubt Intel will have an answer to Zen 2 but I doubt it'll be as early as next year, and frankly I'd be very surprised to see another 40+% IPC uplift over a single generation on either x86 architecture. Aside from very narrow applications obviously, like another doubling of AVX throughput or dedicated instructions for en/decoding etc.
Fox2232
Senior Member
Posts: 9380
Joined: 2012-07-20
Senior Member
Posts: 9380
Joined: 2012-07-20
#5681445 Posted on: 06/17/2019 10:52 AM
Last time their figures matched was last time they used term IPC as instructions per clock/cycle and not as instructions per core.
Since then you have to somewhat convert their "IPC" figures to real world ones. That's if you know at what clock they tested. Should be noted that their comparison with high 18% "IPC" gain was against skylake chip (where even 6700K had boost of 4.2GHz only) likely equipped with as slow memory (2133MHz) as they officially support for given chip.
Memory difference easily explains those up to 40% higher results too.
And it should be noted that this skylake comparison was made for very specific purpose since skylake is officially "Discontinued".
When was the last time Intels pre-release performance didn't match up with the final product? They have a far better record than AMD in this department, yet I can't recall you ever adding a disclaimer to news about their performance numbers. Come to think of it, i also don't recall you making product announcement articles from nV or Intel pinned at the top of the forum either. At least try and show a little objectivity
Last time their figures matched was last time they used term IPC as instructions per clock/cycle and not as instructions per core.
Since then you have to somewhat convert their "IPC" figures to real world ones. That's if you know at what clock they tested. Should be noted that their comparison with high 18% "IPC" gain was against skylake chip (where even 6700K had boost of 4.2GHz only) likely equipped with as slow memory (2133MHz) as they officially support for given chip.
Memory difference easily explains those up to 40% higher results too.
And it should be noted that this skylake comparison was made for very specific purpose since skylake is officially "Discontinued".
BLEH!
Senior Member
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Senior Member
Posts: 5860
Joined: 2010-10-17
#5681446 Posted on: 06/17/2019 10:52 AM
Will believe numbers with real reviews, not until. AMD will be cheaper, and therefore more likely to get my money.
Will believe numbers with real reviews, not until. AMD will be cheaper, and therefore more likely to get my money.
anticupidon
Senior Member
Posts: 3684
Joined: 2008-03-06
Senior Member
Posts: 3684
Joined: 2008-03-06
#5681447 Posted on: 06/17/2019 10:54 AM
Let's wait and see real benchmarks, until that time everything is just talk.
Let's wait and see real benchmarks, until that time everything is just talk.
las
Senior Member
Posts: 260
Joined: 2013-03-18
Senior Member
Posts: 260
Joined: 2013-03-18
#5681448 Posted on: 06/17/2019 10:54 AM
I love your mindshare. Vaporware counters unreleased product.
One likely does not exist and you know very little, borderline nothing about other.
And then people are surprised that AMD does not play way they want them to.
Oh, I do know Turing refresh is coming very shortly.
I love your mindshare. Vaporware counters unreleased product.
One likely does not exist and you know very little, borderline nothing about other.
And then people are surprised that AMD does not play way they want them to.
Oh, I do know Turing refresh is coming very shortly.
Fox2232
Senior Member
Posts: 9380
Joined: 2012-07-20
Senior Member
Posts: 9380
Joined: 2012-07-20
#5681449 Posted on: 06/17/2019 10:56 AM
Know or presume/believe. Make your mind. If you lie to yourself, and spread it, then you lie to us!
I do not like liars. But I like fools even less. Because liars do that at least for purpose.
Oh, I do know Turing refresh is coming very shortly.
Know or presume/believe. Make your mind. If you lie to yourself, and spread it, then you lie to us!
I do not like liars. But I like fools even less. Because liars do that at least for purpose.
Undying
Senior Member
Posts: 11240
Joined: 2008-08-28
Senior Member
Posts: 11240
Joined: 2008-08-28
#5681453 Posted on: 06/17/2019 11:05 AM
I say let the turing refresh come. Let the amd release navi 20. Let the intel compete with zen2.
That will all benefit us so lets be happy instead arguing.
I say let the turing refresh come. Let the amd release navi 20. Let the intel compete with zen2.
That will all benefit us so lets be happy instead arguing.
Luc
Member
Posts: 48
Joined: 2017-09-22
Member
Posts: 48
Joined: 2017-09-22
#5681460 Posted on: 06/17/2019 11:29 AM
I remember, maybe I'm wrong, that 40% improvement will happen on AI related workloads.
18% it's the best score it will achieve in usual workloads, but still impressive performance uplift.
It will came first to mobile chips, close to Zen 2 APU, and it will be great, because we'll have better CPUs and integrated GPUs around, if vendors offer good quality AMD laptops and Intel don't play dirt, as it does whenever is on trouble.
Then, SunnyCove will come glued to servers, and later to desktop, I think
I remember, maybe I'm wrong, that 40% improvement will happen on AI related workloads.
18% it's the best score it will achieve in usual workloads, but still impressive performance uplift.
It will came first to mobile chips, close to Zen 2 APU, and it will be great, because we'll have better CPUs and integrated GPUs around, if vendors offer good quality AMD laptops and Intel don't play dirt, as it does whenever is on trouble.
Then, SunnyCove will come glued to servers, and later to desktop, I think
fantaskarsef
Senior Member
Posts: 10470
Joined: 2014-07-21
Senior Member
Posts: 10470
Joined: 2014-07-21
#5681461 Posted on: 06/17/2019 11:29 AM
Objectivity works with official release notes and confirmed numbers. Being sceptical about something some guy puts together a few lines with some CPU names and a few numbers, posting it in some forum on the nets does not make it something to even be considered worth noting, and doubting this is in no way against being objective. The "grain of salt" here is that it's not an official chanel, it's not an official rep, and so on. Read again before complaining:
Doubting this is more logical than blind belief everything in that "table" (which it isn't even or the names and numbers would be lined up better).
It would also be logical and sensible to doubt any of this until there's true benchmarks comparing the products. When that stuff someday lands in test areas outside of any marketing department and any NDAs.
When was the last time Intels pre-release performance didn't match up with the final product? They have a far better record than AMD in this department, yet I can't recall you ever adding a disclaimer to news about their performance numbers. Come to think of it, i also don't recall you making product announcement articles from nV or Intel pinned at the top of the forum either. At least try and show a little objectivity
Objectivity works with official release notes and confirmed numbers. Being sceptical about something some guy puts together a few lines with some CPU names and a few numbers, posting it in some forum on the nets does not make it something to even be considered worth noting, and doubting this is in no way against being objective. The "grain of salt" here is that it's not an official chanel, it's not an official rep, and so on. Read again before complaining:
You need to wonder though, how would an Asia website with an unknown forum member get access to unreleased processors from both sides with, apparently, full support of the procs in CPU-Z?
Doubting this is more logical than blind belief everything in that "table" (which it isn't even or the names and numbers would be lined up better).
It would also be logical and sensible to doubt any of this until there's true benchmarks comparing the products. When that stuff someday lands in test areas outside of any marketing department and any NDAs.
Petr V
Senior Member
Posts: 199
Joined: 2018-08-04
Senior Member
Posts: 199
Joined: 2018-08-04
#5681462 Posted on: 06/17/2019 11:29 AM
Intel trolling us again.
Intel must show something to slow down the zen2 hype. Release date and pricing unknown. Hah, most of us will already rock a ryzen cpus until these see the light of day.
Intel trolling us again.
Click here to post a comment for this news story on the message forum.
Senior Member
Posts: 260
Joined: 2013-03-18
I have no doubt in my mind that Intel will hit back hard when they are leaving the 14nm node soon.
I don't need anything tho. I have Ryzen 1700 @ 3 (underclocked and undervolted) in my server and 9900K @ 5.2 in my gaming rig. I would be surprised if Zen 2 is going to match 9900K - or even 8700K - in gaming anyway, especially CPU bound aka high fps gaming. Would be fun tho. I like competition.
Would be nice to see some competition in the GPU space now. Nvidia is dominating. Especially outside of low to mid-end market.
RTX 2060 "Super" and 2070 "Super" countered Navi 5700 and 5700 XT before they even released... Imagine if Nvidia really wanted to destroy AMD and put out 7nm now, instead of Turing refresh at 12nm again.
I need Ampere 7nm EUV before I buy anything.