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Ryzen Zen 2 Procs Incompatible With Some Older 300-Series due to BIOS limitation?
Many of you are waiting on the launch of ZEN2 aka Ryzen 3000 and have an X370 motherboard in the hope to upgrade to the new proc. That might be an issue, indications right now it probably might not work on older 300-series chipset motherboards such as X370.
Website Forbes has posted a response sent by motherboard manufacturer MSI towards a Reddit user, in that reply the company mentions that AMD's Zen 2 processors will not work on older 300-series chipset motherboards. The company claims that the new CPUs will only work with 400-series, such as B450 and X470 chipsets. Shortly thereafter we've seen news-posts that MSI would be doing this purely out of pure greed etc. Such wording seems to be incorrect.
Really, this raises the question if all motherboard manufacturers will face the same issue, or it this might be an individual motherboard manufacturer decision as to whether or now they support AMD's Zen 2 CPUs, which are due for release this summer. If MSI would not support it, chances are really high that there is incompatibility or a choice made at AMD to not support Ryzen 3000 on the 300 series.
Here's the likely and probable reason, earlier on it was indicated that a BIOS chip limitations could be a factor in whether your board can support 3000-series Ryzen processors or not, support for 3000-series chips may now come down to a question of something as simple as its 16MiByte flash storage on the (and all) 300 series. We know that the 400 series already anticipated this being able to store 32MiBytes. If that is the case, all motherboard more manufacturers will drop Ryzen 3000 support on X370, B350 and A320 as it is simply incompatible at least on the models with a 16MiByte flash storage. So that doesn't mean some models WILL actually support the new procs, if they can.
AMD is aware of this and is going to release an "AMD Ryzen Desktop 3000 ready" badge just to address this.
Update: After some rather gnarly accusations on the web MSI responded with the following:
"It has come to our attention that MSI customer support has regrettably misinformed an MSI customer with regards to potential support for next-gen AMD CPUs on the MSI X370 XPower Gaming Titanium motherboard. Through this statement we want to clarify the current situation," MSI said.
"At this point, we are still performing extensive testing on our existing lineup of 300- and 400-series AM4 motherboards to verify potential compatibility for the next-gen AMD Ryzen CPUs. To be clear: Our intention is to offer maximum compatibility for as many MSI products as possible. Towards the launch of the next-gen AMD CPUs, we will release a compatibility list of MSI AM4 motherboards," MSI added.
Below a full list of current and previous generation MSI motherboards that have already been qualified to work with Ryzen 3000:
- X470 Gaming M7 AC
- X470 Gaming Pro Carbon
- X470 Gaming Pro Carbon AC
- X470 Gaming Plus
- X470 Gaming Pro
- B450M Bazooka and B450 Bazooka V2
- B450 M Pro-VDH and B450 M Pro VDH V2
- B450M Pro-VDH Plus
- B450I Gaming Plus AC
- B450M Pro-M2 and B450M Pro-M2 V2
- B450M Thunder
- B450 Gaming Pro Carbon AC
- B450 Gaming Plus
- B450-A Pro
- B450M Gaming Plus
- B450M Mortar
- B450M Titanium
- B450M Bazooka Plus and B450M Booka Plus V2
- B450M Tomhawk
- X370 XPower Gaming Titanium
- X370 Gaming Pro Carbon
- X370 Gaming Pro Carbon AC
- X370 Gaming Plus
- X370 Gaming Pro
- X370 Krait Gaming
- X370 SLI Plus
- X370 Gaming M7 ACK
- B350 Tomahawk
- B350 PC Mate
- B350 Tomahawk Arctic
- B350 Gaming Plus
- B350M Mortar
- M350M Mortar Arctic
- B350M Bazooka
- B350M Pro-VDH
- B350M Gaming Pro
- B350I Pro AC
- B350 Gaming Pro Carbon
- B350M Pro-VH Plus
- B350 Krait Gaming
- B350 Tomahawk Plus
- Be50M Pro-VD Plus
Clawedge
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#5660476 Posted on: 04/16/2019 07:41 AM
Well shit. Not cool. But still better than you know who.
At least AMD supported 1000 and 2000 chips on the 300 series chipset
Well shit. Not cool. But still better than you know who.
At least AMD supported 1000 and 2000 chips on the 300 series chipset
Kaarme
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#5660479 Posted on: 04/16/2019 07:49 AM
If it truly is universal and not only a strong excuse for the mobo makers to boost their sales, I don't see it being hugely different from the scumbag move Intel did with Coffee Lake. In some sense it would be even worse because Intel never promises future compatibility and everybody more or less expects incompatibility from Intel these days. That's so even when Intel is being especially nasty like how they were by releasing the incompatible Coffee Lake so soon after the "we have perfect trust in" Kaby Lake. Intel doesn't even pretend to be customer friendly, but AMD did.
That's why I think it would be interesting if one manufacturer made some of their models compatible, creating a PR headache for the others.
If it truly is universal and not only a strong excuse for the mobo makers to boost their sales, I don't see it being hugely different from the scumbag move Intel did with Coffee Lake. In some sense it would be even worse because Intel never promises future compatibility and everybody more or less expects incompatibility from Intel these days. That's so even when Intel is being especially nasty like how they were by releasing the incompatible Coffee Lake so soon after the "we have perfect trust in" Kaby Lake. Intel doesn't even pretend to be customer friendly, but AMD did.
That's why I think it would be interesting if one manufacturer made some of their models compatible, creating a PR headache for the others.
asturur
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#5660486 Posted on: 04/16/2019 08:09 AM
For bios chip are we talking about the chip that contains the UEFI OS layer?
I believe they can cut on corners and made the code fit? Like a bios for people that wants to install it and will remove some functionality to save space. ( like checking from the internet if a new bios is available or this kind of things )
For bios chip are we talking about the chip that contains the UEFI OS layer?
I believe they can cut on corners and made the code fit? Like a bios for people that wants to install it and will remove some functionality to save space. ( like checking from the internet if a new bios is available or this kind of things )
fantaskarsef
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#5660489 Posted on: 04/16/2019 08:20 AM
Honestly, even with AMD this had to happen at some point. I did not expect them to support their new releases on older mainboard forever.
What they should do is to offer a BIOS which you can flash under your own discretion (and under no warranty) that removes Ryzen 1000 compatability in favour of adding Ryzen 3000 BIOS. Would be a simple BIOS flash, if they offered such a version anyway.
Honestly, even with AMD this had to happen at some point. I did not expect them to support their new releases on older mainboard forever.
What they should do is to offer a BIOS which you can flash under your own discretion (and under no warranty) that removes Ryzen 1000 compatability in favour of adding Ryzen 3000 BIOS. Would be a simple BIOS flash, if they offered such a version anyway.
Deckard
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#5660503 Posted on: 04/16/2019 09:02 AM
The Asus Crosshair VI Hero & Extreme x370 Motherboard have 128 Mb Flash ROM. so as far as I am reading it my x370 CHVIE should be OK
The Asus Crosshair VI Hero & Extreme x370 Motherboard have 128 Mb Flash ROM. so as far as I am reading it my x370 CHVIE should be OK
BuildeR2
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#5660506 Posted on: 04/16/2019 09:05 AM
If this ends up being true for some motherboards, won't some enterprising modders take a whack at it?
If this ends up being true for some motherboards, won't some enterprising modders take a whack at it?
TalentX
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#5660508 Posted on: 04/16/2019 09:05 AM
Not like you need a +100 bucks mainboard for a gaming-rig anyway...
The Asus Crosshair VI Hero & Extreme x370 Motherboard have 128 Mb Flash ROM. so as far as I am reading it my x370 CHVIE should be OK
Not like you need a +100 bucks mainboard for a gaming-rig anyway...
HardwareCaps
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#5660509 Posted on: 04/16/2019 09:11 AM
AMD lied basically claiming AM4 support up to 2020? That's pretty lame....
AMD lied basically claiming AM4 support up to 2020? That's pretty lame....
Deckard
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#5660510 Posted on: 04/16/2019 09:14 AM
Not sure what you mean, elaborate please on your pearl of wisdom
Not like you need a +100 bucks mainboard for a gaming-rig anyway...
Not sure what you mean, elaborate please on your pearl of wisdom
dunadan101
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#5660513 Posted on: 04/16/2019 09:25 AM
This tbqh... Bought a 1600x with a quite expensive kit of Ryzen compatible 3200Mhz Cl14 FlareX because my already very good DDR4 Corsair 3Ghz ram wouldn't work on the AM4 platform but I thought down the line I'ld save money anyway. Like many people only reason I bought a Ryzen rather than a faster Intel cpu was that I was promised 7nm Ryzen2 compatibility down the line. Looking at the comments people are jumping to make excuses for them already, Oh.. guess it's okay when AMD does it huh? If true, this really sucks. I'll keep my fingers crossed.
AMD lied basically claiming AM4 support up to 2020? That's pretty lame....
This tbqh... Bought a 1600x with a quite expensive kit of Ryzen compatible 3200Mhz Cl14 FlareX because my already very good DDR4 Corsair 3Ghz ram wouldn't work on the AM4 platform but I thought down the line I'ld save money anyway. Like many people only reason I bought a Ryzen rather than a faster Intel cpu was that I was promised 7nm Ryzen2 compatibility down the line. Looking at the comments people are jumping to make excuses for them already, Oh.. guess it's okay when AMD does it huh? If true, this really sucks. I'll keep my fingers crossed.
fantaskarsef
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#5660516 Posted on: 04/16/2019 09:33 AM
Oh, you mean, just like Intel does on consumer line?
I have never understood why people want to use an old and outdated motherboard with a new CPU anyway. Motherboards are not expensive (unless you're stupid and buy the expensive ones) and it's easier to sell an old CPU with a motherboard.
I always buy a new board when I buy a new CPU. I want the latest features.
Not everybody has the money, and in theory, this could have been a way for AMD to bind people to their brand / socket for more than two or three years.
But in general I buy a new MB myself with every iteration of a CPU.
Oh, you mean, just like Intel does on consumer line?
I have never understood why people want to use an old and outdated motherboard with a new CPU anyway. Motherboards are not expensive (unless you're stupid and buy the expensive ones) and it's easier to sell an old CPU with a motherboard.
I always buy a new board when I buy a new CPU. I want the latest features.
Not everybody has the money, and in theory, this could have been a way for AMD to bind people to their brand / socket for more than two or three years.
But in general I buy a new MB myself with every iteration of a CPU.
Clawedge
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#5660519 Posted on: 04/16/2019 09:35 AM
@
Always helpful if you have say an old mobo and new CPU and want to make a useable system.
Came across multiple instances where an Ivy bridge chip would not work on a Sandy bridge mobo (socket 1155). Was a major inconvenience.
@
las
Always helpful if you have say an old mobo and new CPU and want to make a useable system.
Came across multiple instances where an Ivy bridge chip would not work on a Sandy bridge mobo (socket 1155). Was a major inconvenience.
chispy
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#5660520 Posted on: 04/16/2019 09:37 AM
@Hilbert Hagedoorn , Asus have already released 2 new Bios updates for the new upcoming cpus for all of their motherboards x370 , B350 , A320 hence i do not think there will be major problems if Asus can deliver new Bios for the old x370s , B350s also including the basic A320 chipset line of motherboards , meaning all Asus motherboards AM4 do support the new upcoming processors. If Asus have already released this Bios updates for all the AM4 motherboards up to and including older x370 , B350 , A320 , x470 ,B450 , i would think every manufacturer will release Bios updates too supporting the new upcoming processors. Let us hope and let's cross our fingers that every manufacturer release new Bios supporting the new upcoming cpus. AMD promise support of AM4 until year 2020
Examples and pictures from Asus website support page ( source ) :
Asus ROG Crossahir 6 Hero " x370 " : https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/ROG-CROSSHAIR-VI-HERO/HelpDesk-BIOS/
Asus Strix B350-F Gaming " B350 " : https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/ROG-STRIX-B350-F-GAMING/HelpDesk-BIOS/
Asus Prime A320M-A ( the most basic and old motherboard from Asus line up supports the new upcomming cpus " A320 " chipset. : https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/PRIME-A320M-A/HelpDesk-BIOS/
@Hilbert Hagedoorn , Asus have already released 2 new Bios updates for the new upcoming cpus for all of their motherboards x370 , B350 , A320 hence i do not think there will be major problems if Asus can deliver new Bios for the old x370s , B350s also including the basic A320 chipset line of motherboards , meaning all Asus motherboards AM4 do support the new upcoming processors. If Asus have already released this Bios updates for all the AM4 motherboards up to and including older x370 , B350 , A320 , x470 ,B450 , i would think every manufacturer will release Bios updates too supporting the new upcoming processors. Let us hope and let's cross our fingers that every manufacturer release new Bios supporting the new upcoming cpus. AMD promise support of AM4 until year 2020
Examples and pictures from Asus website support page ( source ) :
Asus ROG Crossahir 6 Hero " x370 " : https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/ROG-CROSSHAIR-VI-HERO/HelpDesk-BIOS/
Asus Strix B350-F Gaming " B350 " : https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/ROG-STRIX-B350-F-GAMING/HelpDesk-BIOS/
Asus Prime A320M-A ( the most basic and old motherboard from Asus line up supports the new upcomming cpus
" A320 " chipset. : https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/PRIME-A320M-A/HelpDesk-BIOS/
386SX
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#5660522 Posted on: 04/16/2019 09:41 AM
Sry but no. 128Mb are 128 megabit (lowercase "b"), not megabyte. 8 bit equals 1 byte. So 128 : 8 = 16 (megabyte). 32 megabytes are needed.
The Asus Crosshair VI Hero & Extreme x370 Motherboard have 128 Mb Flash ROM. so as far as I am reading it my x370 CHVIE should be OK
Sry but no. 128Mb are 128 megabit (lowercase "b"), not megabyte. 8 bit equals 1 byte. So 128 : 8 = 16 (megabyte). 32 megabytes are needed.
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Well, many older boards predating APU releases were not exactly best choices for them due to VRMs not being sufficient for iGPU.
One should consider it from technological perspective and then assess if it is reasonable or not.
Last thing company wants is to enable upgrade which will prove to cause issues.
Edit: On other hand, MSI lately makes boards which are not up to standard in their price range. And one is more often than not better off buying board from other manufacturer. Therefore there is chance that it may be just some or all MSI's boards.