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MSI drops functions from BIOS of AMD's 300 and 400 series motherboards to support Ryzen 3000
Now I say MSI here, but this will not be specific towards MSI as all manufacturers have to deal with it. Remember a while ago when we mentioned that Ryzen 3000 procs might not be supported on Series 300 and 400 motherboards due to a too small BIOS storage size?
Well, here's the thing, quickly after that discussion surfaced, AMD and the motherboard manufacturers swiftly declared Ryzen 3000 support.
Here's the thing (2), the old BIOS EPROM sizes are 16MB. You can only store that much data on it. Over the years more and more procs and memory has been added and at one point, it's stuffed. You have to say that this problem is more apparent for AMD as they have a shitload of processors for socket AM4, and that is now working against them. The X570 motherboards all have a 32MB BIOS EEPROM to store data, so that's save as it's doubled up right?
MSI now has explained on their website how they will bring Ryzen 3000 support towards say certain Series 300 chipsets, simply put .. you can't have it all. So they have removed older (aging) processors from the new firmware and added Ryzen series 3000 processors. Next, to that, a number of features have been scrapped. A-series and Athlon processors from the 28nm Bristol Ridge generation are no longer supported in the firmware. In addition, the MSI proprietary possibility for SATA raid has been removed but might be back after the BIOS leaves Beta stages. Last but not least you'll notice a very slim GUI UEFI interface. This applies specifically to MSI's boards however other manufacturers also use a 16 MB bios chip, so they will have to make choices as well. All is not a biggy for most people of course.
Aura89
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Posts: 8408
Joined: 2008-07-31
#5689293 Posted on: 07/09/2019 06:23 PM
I would happily lose my fancy GUI with mouse support for the old fashion, simple yet useable and functional, 4 color bios screens.
I really feel like if they have to remove stuff from the bios, that's the first thing that should go. Anything else should be after as at that point you are lowering the functionality of the board to increase the functionality of the board....
All of these icons and graphics and etc. don't need to be there.
I would happily lose my fancy GUI with mouse support for the old fashion, simple yet useable and functional, 4 color bios screens.
I really feel like if they have to remove stuff from the bios, that's the first thing that should go. Anything else should be after as at that point you are lowering the functionality of the board to increase the functionality of the board....
All of these icons and graphics and etc. don't need to be there.
Kaarme
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Joined: 2013-03-10
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Posts: 3404
Joined: 2013-03-10
#5689307 Posted on: 07/09/2019 06:47 PM
I wonder how many cents the mobo manufacturers saved by using 16MB instead of 32MB. But every small thing contributes to the profits.
I wonder how many cents the mobo manufacturers saved by using 16MB instead of 32MB. But every small thing contributes to the profits.
schmidtbag
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Posts: 7422
Joined: 2012-11-10
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Posts: 7422
Joined: 2012-11-10
#5689312 Posted on: 07/09/2019 07:02 PM
No more 9500E support!? That's it, I'm never buying MSI again. Totally unacceptable. I don't even care that I only need to pick one BIOS version to suit the CPU I have, the principle of the matter is they dropped features and I won't stand for this!
*hyperventilates over getting excessively triggered*
On a serious note:
I would happily lose my fancy GUI with mouse support for the old fashion, simple yet useable and functional, 4 color bios screens.
I really feel like if they have to remove stuff from the bios, that's the first thing that should go. Anything else should be after as at that point you are lowering the functionality of the board to increase the functionality of the board....
All of these icons and graphics and etc. don't need to be there.
I was thinking the same thing, though, maybe they don't even have to go that far. I'm sure they waste a hell of a lot more space with a few of those graphics (which are probably bitmaps) than the new microcode. They could still have a GUI with all the benefits (like live sensor data) but they could probably cut back on some of the cheesy graphics, and maybe go down to 16-bit color. That way, everyone wins: you get a cleaner interface that isn't limited to the appeal of teenage boys, and, you get to include all AM4 microcode. Granted, the screenshots of that interface don't look as bad as others I've seen.
Another thing worth pointing out is I've commonly found Intel-specific features in a few more budget-oriented boards. Sometimes they were grayed-out since they obviously didn't do anything, but I wonder if perhaps the code for them is still there. I doubt there's enough of this kind of unusable code they could clean up to make room for Zen2, but, it sure wouldn't hurt.
I wonder how many cents the mobo manufacturers saved by using 16MB instead of 32MB. But every small thing contributes to the profits.
These kinds of EEPROM tend to be much more expensive per Kb than just about any other form of modern storage. It wouldn't surprise me if they actually saved over a dollar by going for 16Mb. Of course, it all depends on how it's all interfaced, because sometimes one of those chips can range from $0.50 to $4.50.
wHaT!!!1?!
No more 9500E support!? That's it, I'm never buying MSI again. Totally unacceptable. I don't even care that I only need to pick one BIOS version to suit the CPU I have, the principle of the matter is they dropped features and I won't stand for this!
*hyperventilates over getting excessively triggered*
On a serious note:
I would happily lose my fancy GUI with mouse support for the old fashion, simple yet useable and functional, 4 color bios screens.
I really feel like if they have to remove stuff from the bios, that's the first thing that should go. Anything else should be after as at that point you are lowering the functionality of the board to increase the functionality of the board....
All of these icons and graphics and etc. don't need to be there.
I was thinking the same thing, though, maybe they don't even have to go that far. I'm sure they waste a hell of a lot more space with a few of those graphics (which are probably bitmaps) than the new microcode. They could still have a GUI with all the benefits (like live sensor data) but they could probably cut back on some of the cheesy graphics, and maybe go down to 16-bit color. That way, everyone wins: you get a cleaner interface that isn't limited to the appeal of teenage boys, and, you get to include all AM4 microcode. Granted, the screenshots of that interface don't look as bad as others I've seen.
Another thing worth pointing out is I've commonly found Intel-specific features in a few more budget-oriented boards. Sometimes they were grayed-out since they obviously didn't do anything, but I wonder if perhaps the code for them is still there. I doubt there's enough of this kind of unusable code they could clean up to make room for Zen2, but, it sure wouldn't hurt.
I wonder how many cents the mobo manufacturers saved by using 16MB instead of 32MB. But every small thing contributes to the profits.
These kinds of EEPROM tend to be much more expensive per Kb than just about any other form of modern storage. It wouldn't surprise me if they actually saved over a dollar by going for 16Mb. Of course, it all depends on how it's all interfaced, because sometimes one of those chips can range from $0.50 to $4.50.
waltc3
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Joined: 2014-07-22
Senior Member
Posts: 1443
Joined: 2014-07-22
#5689314 Posted on: 07/09/2019 07:04 PM
The loss of SATA RAID function is temporary, only. Will be restored when bios leaves beta, apparently.
https://www.msi.com/blog/the-latest-bios-for-amd-300-400-series-motherboard
The only thing I saw actually missing was the graphical bling, which isn't necessary, imo. This bios UI reminds me of what UEFI bioses looked like when they were first introduced.
The loss of SATA RAID function is temporary, only. Will be restored when bios leaves beta, apparently.
https://www.msi.com/blog/the-latest-bios-for-amd-300-400-series-motherboard
The only thing I saw actually missing was the graphical bling, which isn't necessary, imo. This bios UI reminds me of what UEFI bioses looked like when they were first introduced.
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Joined: 2015-06-11
Didn't notice anything like that in the C6H with the last BIOS (but still built with ComboPI 1.0.0.2). Even CBS is fully unlocked.