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Guru3D Rig of the Month - December 2019
High-end Skylake processors to get yet another socket
Intel is a big fan of swapping out CPU socket as often as they can, it seems that with the successor to Broadwell-E, the Skylake-X and Kaby Lake-X (yes the X is new) we'll move to Socket 2066. new information surfaced, read it after the break.
The platform for all this is called Basin Falls platform and includes new processors and a chipset refresh with a new socket . Socket R4, as the official code name reads is getting 2,066 pins and provides a home to two new Skylake-X and Kaby Lake-X series.
Skylake-X will include six , eight and ten core CPUs with a TDP around 140 watts and thus follow Broadwell-E . Under the name Kaby Lake-X there are also will be quad-cores for socket 2066, with fewer PCI Express lanes and only two memory channels. Also for Kaby Lake-X Turbo Boost 3.0 is not supported. There will also be a new chipset which includes ten integrated USB 3.0 ports and eight SATA600 ports. It is still unclear whether USB 3.1 will also be part of the chipset. We do know that there are up to 24 PCI Express 3.0 lanes , and a built-in Intel LAN controller are present. According to the leaked slides, the new processors come to market in the second half of 2017.
Click the thuymbnail below.
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slyphnier
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#5309112 Posted on: 07/20/2016 07:51 AM
this time intel naming kinda confusing
i thought -X is replacing -E that for enthusiast class
then what with the kabylake-X (4cores/16lanes) ?
are they planning to merge/release desktop socket to just one type now ?
this time intel naming kinda confusing
i thought -X is replacing -E that for enthusiast class
then what with the kabylake-X (4cores/16lanes) ?
are they planning to merge/release desktop socket to just one type now ?
Fox2232
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#5309115 Posted on: 07/20/2016 07:59 AM
It is just to satisfy upgrade itch. Because there will be many people who may move to Zen just because it is new and shiny platform even if it is just small upgrade over their few years old intel system.
By releasing new socket, manufacturers will make new boards and they'll flood market with even more products for customer to pick from.
(Decreasing chance that someone will jump to AMD's ship.)
It is sound market practice. But unless it brings some new features which were not possible otherwise, it is bad for customer.
It is just to satisfy upgrade itch. Because there will be many people who may move to Zen just because it is new and shiny platform even if it is just small upgrade over their few years old intel system.
By releasing new socket, manufacturers will make new boards and they'll flood market with even more products for customer to pick from.
(Decreasing chance that someone will jump to AMD's ship.)
It is sound market practice. But unless it brings some new features which were not possible otherwise, it is bad for customer.
Dellers
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Posts: 62
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#5309189 Posted on: 07/20/2016 11:31 AM
That late? I was expecting Skylake-E in Q2 like Broadwell-E. After all Skylake is already quite old, and more than two years after the mainstream CPUs is late. May be too late for me then, but I really don't want to buy a new machine right before a new socket comes out either. Like always I assume that the strong dollar won't make the prices in dollars go down, but rather up like usual. It can't be worse than GFX cards though, with a 140% price jump in 5 years because of both exchange rates and increased prices to begin with. I expect the GTX 1080 Ti to be almost 3x as expensive as the 580 was here in Norway, and I guess that Intel will follow that up nicely with the lack of competition.
That late? I was expecting Skylake-E in Q2 like Broadwell-E. After all Skylake is already quite old, and more than two years after the mainstream CPUs is late. May be too late for me then, but I really don't want to buy a new machine right before a new socket comes out either. Like always I assume that the strong dollar won't make the prices in dollars go down, but rather up like usual. It can't be worse than GFX cards though, with a 140% price jump in 5 years because of both exchange rates and increased prices to begin with. I expect the GTX 1080 Ti to be almost 3x as expensive as the 580 was here in Norway, and I guess that Intel will follow that up nicely with the lack of competition.
slyphnier
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Posts: 687
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#5309216 Posted on: 07/20/2016 12:08 PM
its been the trend in intel to release enthusiast class late
and rather CPU performance, it kind of shifted to PCH that give "extra" compared to mainstream PCH
the enthusiast CPU is just more cores compared to mainsteam rather than big-improvement, even theres improvement its just slight (looking to ivy-haswell-broadwell), except you fully using all cores
so not really worth the price/value
we can say intel enthusiast platform is more like a bundle (CPU+PCH/mobo)
but maybe will change with kabylake-x... if kabylake-x inteded for mainstream
then people can choose which cpu they want, either enthusiast version or mainsteam ... considering the socket same, the mobo should support it
That late? I was expecting Skylake-E in Q3 like Broadwell-E. After all Skylake is already quite old, and more than two years after the mainstream CPUs is late. May be too late for me then, but I really don't want to buy a new machine right before a new socket comes out either. Like always I assume that the strong dollar won't make the prices in dollars go down, but rather up like usual. It can't be worse than GFX cards though, with a 140% price jump in 5 years because of both exchange rates and increased prices to begin with. I expect the GTX 1080 Ti to be almost 3x as expensive as the 580 was here in Norway, and I guess that Intel will follow that up nicely with the lack of competition.
its been the trend in intel to release enthusiast class late
and rather CPU performance, it kind of shifted to PCH that give "extra" compared to mainstream PCH
the enthusiast CPU is just more cores compared to mainsteam rather than big-improvement, even theres improvement its just slight (looking to ivy-haswell-broadwell), except you fully using all cores
so not really worth the price/value
we can say intel enthusiast platform is more like a bundle (CPU+PCH/mobo)
but maybe will change with kabylake-x... if kabylake-x inteded for mainstream
then people can choose which cpu they want, either enthusiast version or mainsteam ... considering the socket same, the mobo should support it
MainFrame Alpha
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#5309266 Posted on: 07/20/2016 02:04 PM
was this on Intel road map or it is an answer for the ZEN engineering samples surface?! who knows maybe Zen is the one to bring back balance to the force
was this on Intel road map or it is an answer for the ZEN engineering samples surface?! who knows maybe Zen is the one to bring back balance to the force
BLEH!
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#5309274 Posted on: 07/20/2016 02:20 PM
Intel generally support a socket for 2 generations.
Intel generally support a socket for 2 generations.
Dazz
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#5309301 Posted on: 07/20/2016 03:18 PM
Hardly a surprise they have to keep their chipset business going even if it's not really required.
Hardly a surprise they have to keep their chipset business going even if it's not really required.
GALTARAUJO
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#5309604 Posted on: 07/21/2016 02:32 AM
This is impossible to be done. Can you imagine a 2011-pin socket that is fully compatible with 1150, 1151 and 2011 (both versions)?
Anyway, if what this new chipset has to offer is only more SATA/USB ports and LAN, then adoption will be slow, unless CPUs are overwhelmingly powerful, which I do not expect to be the case.
well after lga 775 all is gone to hell they are changing every year sockets of course it's needed but it would be smarter to make universal socket for example 2000-4000 pin socket and they just add pins to their cpu-s but no they must change it every year like new mobile phones.. 
This is impossible to be done. Can you imagine a 2011-pin socket that is fully compatible with 1150, 1151 and 2011 (both versions)?
Anyway, if what this new chipset has to offer is only more SATA/USB ports and LAN, then adoption will be slow, unless CPUs are overwhelmingly powerful, which I do not expect to be the case.
EspHack
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Posts: 2456
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#5309625 Posted on: 07/21/2016 05:08 AM
i got confused at the kabylake-x part...
i got confused at the kabylake-x part...
Rentesh
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#5309803 Posted on: 07/21/2016 12:19 PM
I too am confused about the Kaby-Lake X part. Quadcore on HEDT in 2017?!?!?!
I too am confused about the Kaby-Lake X part. Quadcore on HEDT in 2017?!?!?!
Size_Mick
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Posts: 419
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#5310745 Posted on: 07/23/2016 06:38 AM
I just purchased an i5 6600k last month on the advice that most games don't take advantage of hyperthreading and many don't take advantage of more than 2 cores. Soon they will have these new CPUs coming out and I'm wondering if anyone thinks things will have changed by then? Or will we (gamers) be just throwing good money away with this?
I just purchased an i5 6600k last month on the advice that most games don't take advantage of hyperthreading and many don't take advantage of more than 2 cores. Soon they will have these new CPUs coming out and I'm wondering if anyone thinks things will have changed by then? Or will we (gamers) be just throwing good money away with this?
sunnyp_343
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#5310746 Posted on: 07/23/2016 06:58 AM
Intel likes changes.
Intel likes changes.
thatguy91
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#5310756 Posted on: 07/23/2016 08:04 AM
Hyperthreading is useful when there are threads that are not maximising the performance of the core. Normally workload would switch between the threads as required with resulting lost processing time with the switch. With hyperthreading two threads can be processed in parallel thus allowing previously unused capacity in the core to go to good use.
For benefit of single application use like gaming, the workload needs to be effectively broken into different streams without the different streams having to wait for the data from another stream to be completed. Gaphics in a game by nature is very parallel, however the non-graphical processing components of the game may not be.
One aspect that could very much and greatly benefit from parallelism is physics processing. This is why Nvidia Physx is done through their GPU's, with the downside of course of it taking away processing power that would otherwise be used for other graphical elements. Nvidia Phsyx is actually a bad example of CPU based Physics as CPU based Physx is still very much not coded for peak performance. There was no incentive for Nvidia to do so as they were promoting their GPU's through Phsyx, if they highly optimised CPU based Phsyx the performance would be much closer to GPU Physx. If the GPU is already maxmised through game elements and the CPU relatively low, CPU Physx could very much have the potential to be faster, if it were coded correctly as it would not take processing time away from other graphical elements.
For a long time their Physx on CPU was in native x86 code. In theory code wise the 32-bit version could run on an 80386... from 1985! It's why it performed so badly on CPU. Most liely as a result of the bad publicity when this became known, Nvidia added the use of SSE2, however even that is old and much of the code could benefit greatly from more modern instruction sets like AVX etc. The code could also be made to be hugely parallel, so you could make use of 32 simultaneous threads with physics processing, if coded correctly (which they aren't).
So the benefit of extra threads depends on the game. I think we may see more thread-friendly games in the future, especially if for example, the upcoming Xbox 'Project Scorpio' uses an 8-core with HT custom Zen type CPU.
Unfortunately games will reflect what is happening in the console world. I'm sure games will make use of the extra performance of 'Project Scorpio' for things other than virtual reality. 4K gaming would be interesting on that, but even with the updated specs I highly suspect some game quality features will be reduced in order to draw 4K resolution.
I just purchased an i5 6600k last month on the advice that most games don't take advantage of hyperthreading and many don't take advantage of more than 2 cores. Soon they will have these new CPUs coming out and I'm wondering if anyone thinks things will have changed by then? Or will we (gamers) be just throwing good money away with this?
Hyperthreading is useful when there are threads that are not maximising the performance of the core. Normally workload would switch between the threads as required with resulting lost processing time with the switch. With hyperthreading two threads can be processed in parallel thus allowing previously unused capacity in the core to go to good use.
For benefit of single application use like gaming, the workload needs to be effectively broken into different streams without the different streams having to wait for the data from another stream to be completed. Gaphics in a game by nature is very parallel, however the non-graphical processing components of the game may not be.
One aspect that could very much and greatly benefit from parallelism is physics processing. This is why Nvidia Physx is done through their GPU's, with the downside of course of it taking away processing power that would otherwise be used for other graphical elements. Nvidia Phsyx is actually a bad example of CPU based Physics as CPU based Physx is still very much not coded for peak performance. There was no incentive for Nvidia to do so as they were promoting their GPU's through Phsyx, if they highly optimised CPU based Phsyx the performance would be much closer to GPU Physx. If the GPU is already maxmised through game elements and the CPU relatively low, CPU Physx could very much have the potential to be faster, if it were coded correctly as it would not take processing time away from other graphical elements.
For a long time their Physx on CPU was in native x86 code. In theory code wise the 32-bit version could run on an 80386... from 1985! It's why it performed so badly on CPU. Most liely as a result of the bad publicity when this became known, Nvidia added the use of SSE2, however even that is old and much of the code could benefit greatly from more modern instruction sets like AVX etc. The code could also be made to be hugely parallel, so you could make use of 32 simultaneous threads with physics processing, if coded correctly (which they aren't).
So the benefit of extra threads depends on the game. I think we may see more thread-friendly games in the future, especially if for example, the upcoming Xbox 'Project Scorpio' uses an 8-core with HT custom Zen type CPU.
Unfortunately games will reflect what is happening in the console world. I'm sure games will make use of the extra performance of 'Project Scorpio' for things other than virtual reality. 4K gaming would be interesting on that, but even with the updated specs I highly suspect some game quality features will be reduced in order to draw 4K resolution.
slyphnier
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#5311820 Posted on: 07/26/2016 12:43 AM
simply depends on how you like to play your game
if you feel fine as long you get stable 60FPS+ on 1440p... then mostly ur cpu will sufficient for a while... as long you upgrade your GPU
but if you want to get full immerse experience, like 4K, VR with graphic setting at high-ultra ... then your cpu might bottlenecking your system
but again that cpu bottleneck might happen if you using like 3way~quadSLI
eitherway, rather than CPU... GPU the one that giving major improvement in gaming
I just purchased an i5 6600k last month on the advice that most games don't take advantage of hyperthreading and many don't take advantage of more than 2 cores. Soon they will have these new CPUs coming out and I'm wondering if anyone thinks things will have changed by then? Or will we (gamers) be just throwing good money away with this?
simply depends on how you like to play your game
if you feel fine as long you get stable 60FPS+ on 1440p... then mostly ur cpu will sufficient for a while... as long you upgrade your GPU
but if you want to get full immerse experience, like 4K, VR with graphic setting at high-ultra ... then your cpu might bottlenecking your system
but again that cpu bottleneck might happen if you using like 3way~quadSLI
eitherway, rather than CPU... GPU the one that giving major improvement in gaming
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Not surprised, somebody has to sell new mainboards