AMD: There is no such thing as full support for DX12 today

by Hilbert Hagedoorn on: 09/01/2015 09:03 AM | source: | 72 comment(s)

After yesterdays turmoil on a lacking DX12 feature for Nvidia AMD’s Robert Hallock shares that Fury X is also missing a number of DX12 features.

The good man replied in a Reddit thread on the DX12 Async shader/compute feature that is missing from NVIDIA’s graphics cards, and then claimed that there is no such thing as “full support” for DX12 on the market today. Which obviously was already known as AMD never claimed full DX12 support on all feature levels with their GCN architecture

“I think gamers are learning an important lesson: there’s no such thing as “full support” for DX12 on the market today.” said Robert and continued:

“There have been many attempts to distract people from this truth through campaigns that deliberately conflate feature levels, individual untiered features and the definition of “support.” This has been confusing, and caused so much unnecessary heartache and rumor-mongering.

Here is the unvarnished truth: Every graphics architecture has unique features, and no one architecture has them all. Some of those unique features are more powerful than others.

Yes, we’re extremely pleased that people are finally beginning to see the game of chess we’ve been playing with the interrelationship of GCN, Mantle, DX12, Vulkan and LiquidVR.”

When somebody asked what are the aspects of DX12 that the FuryX is missing, Hallock replied and listed them.

“Raster Ordered Views and Conservative Raster. Thankfully, the techniques that these enable (like global illumination) can already be done in other ways at high framerates (see: DiRT Showdown).”

So it is simple, currently no graphics card with full 100% DirectX 12 support, that means that some games are to favor AMD and others Nvidia.

I want to add thing here, yesterday Hallock was all over this downplaying Nvidia and evangelizing how good their GPUs are, and now he is taking a step back with these answers on Reddit.

It's all marketing mud-fighting and attacking each other these days in-between Nvidia and AMD. Fun fact: on the AMD GPU Tech day for Fury, I myself literally confronted and asked about the DX12 supported feature levels to Hallock, and in this case Hallock himself absolutely refused to give a valid answer at the time as he very well knew that AMD would not fully support DX12 either.

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theoneofgod
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#5151311 Posted on: 09/01/2015 01:52 AM

Bare with me... on phone.

*Grabs a coffee

(.)(.)
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#5151315 Posted on: 09/01/2015 01:57 AM

*Grabs a coffee

lol.

OT, what these gpu vendors up to :3eyes:

Elder III
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#5151399 Posted on: 09/01/2015 05:38 AM

Marketing and hyperbole from both sides.

Dazz
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#5151458 Posted on: 09/01/2015 08:38 AM

Infairness to AMD they showed the Fury as DX12 tier 2 (12_0) support so clearly it's not 100% DX12 compliant since it needs to be tier 3 (12_1) to be 100% compliant, i was kinda surprised that they didn't have it as tier 3 (12_1) but i guess they didn't want it to backfire if x doesn't work or perform like it should.

http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/amd-radeon-r9-fury-x-review,8.html

Which you can see here. So they have not advertised it as 100% compliant unlike their competitor.

http://international.download.nvidia.com/geforce-com/international/images/nvidia-geforce-gtx-980-ti/nvidia-geforce-gtx-980-ti-directx-12-advanced-api-support.png

Fox2232
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#5151469 Posted on: 09/01/2015 09:07 AM

Why is this news? We know it for very long time. Any kind of 'news' like this will not remove nVidia's problems.
And that comes from 2 simple things in regards of supported features:
- does feature improve visuals?
- does it improve performance?
- > and as result: is visual change worth performance impact? Or does it improve both visuals & performance?

So, you can take all 'new' nVidia's features which AMD did not implement (yet?), and see if you want those in games. Then, you can do same for AMD having stuff nVidia misses.

But since DX12 is mainly for purpose of removing different kind of bottlenecks (includes scheduling?), features which matter are ...

thatguy91
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#5151477 Posted on: 09/01/2015 09:30 AM

Yes, it seems the claim on Nvidia's side seems they did what was required to scrape in at 12_1, just for marketability sake. Performance wise it means nothing since you don't have asynchronous shaders, and especially if the following is the norm:
http://forums.guru3d.com/showpost.php?p=5149904&postcount=20

That was my reply in response to someone showing the performance scaling of DirectX 12 on various CPU's. Regardless of anything else, DirectX 12 should be faster than DirectX 11 right? Not significantly slower at 1080P High quality? People buy one brand of GPU over another over a difference between 50.1 fps (DirectX 12) and 58.4 fps (DirectX 11). Sadly, that's not around the wrong way!

Barry J
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#5151480 Posted on: 09/01/2015 09:38 AM

I am not surprised by this DX12 is new they had to have main GPU providers on board to get wide spread support of api.

Actual Feature support will be decided when we have more games and not only a AMD biased benchmark. NVidia have on there web site in writing Maxwell 2 has Async compute it may just work differently and need some sort of driver to get it working. Only time will tell.

this will be the same as DX11 some games will run better for a particular brand it depends on the way the games been made.

riardon
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#5151493 Posted on: 09/01/2015 10:01 AM

Classic stuff. Marketing hyperboles from both sides. It's really too early for DX12. It doesn't matter too much as we will have to wait at least 1 year to see some DX12 games out and new GFX cards from both companies. Then we can talk and compare but now it's really early.

Batboy
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#5151507 Posted on: 09/01/2015 10:18 AM

When I bought my 980 a few months ago, I was said by the retailer that my card had full directx 12 support. Surprise!

rl66
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#5151511 Posted on: 09/01/2015 10:22 AM

We know that since a long time, it is writen even on Fury spec... better late than never, thank AMD lol

rl66
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#5151512 Posted on: 09/01/2015 10:24 AM

When I bought my 980 a few months ago, I was said by the retailer that my card had full directx 12 support. Surprise!

it has real DX12 support but not full (you know the new crap .0 .1 .2 introduced by M$. lol)

sajibjoarder
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#5151528 Posted on: 09/01/2015 10:46 AM

at least amd is honest.. they dont cheat their customers

Turanis
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#5151536 Posted on: 09/01/2015 10:50 AM

Thanks for sharing this.

From Hilbert article:
"It's all marketing mud-fighting and attacking each other these days in-between Nvidia and AMD. Fun fact: on the AMD GPU Tech day for Fury, I myself literally confronted and asked about the DX12 supported feature levels to Hallock, and in this case Hallock himself absolutely refused to give a valid answer at the time as he very well knew that AMD would not fully support DX12 either."

Ofc its a marketing thing/war.
nvidia from I read these years its all about lies&lies all over.Now Amd tell the truth about Mantle development and about DX12 support in their cards.
DX12 its like a baby,you know,still learn how to walk ,how to work (at this point).

Barry J
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#5151537 Posted on: 09/01/2015 10:54 AM

at least amd is honest.. they dont cheat their customers

so how well does the fury overclock "overclockers Dream"

I waited to buy a Fury X or a 980ti i would say AMD where dishonest about Overclocking ability

rl66
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#5151538 Posted on: 09/01/2015 10:55 AM

at least amd is honest.. they dont cheat their customers

after the "Honest" word you forget "this time", i remember the argument that make me buy a HD7850... the worse bought i have done (btw still have it as no one want it... only 3 week of use).

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