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AMD: There is no such thing as full support for DX12 today
After yesterdays turmoil on a lacking DX12 feature for Nvidia AMD’s Robert Hallock shares that Fury X is also missing a number of DX12 features.
The good man replied in a Reddit thread on the DX12 Async shader/compute feature that is missing from NVIDIA’s graphics cards, and then claimed that there is no such thing as “full support” for DX12 on the market today. Which obviously was already known as AMD never claimed full DX12 support on all feature levels with their GCN architecture
“I think gamers are learning an important lesson: there’s no such thing as “full support” for DX12 on the market today.” said Robert and continued:
“There have been many attempts to distract people from this truth through campaigns that deliberately conflate feature levels, individual untiered features and the definition of “support.” This has been confusing, and caused so much unnecessary heartache and rumor-mongering.
Here is the unvarnished truth: Every graphics architecture has unique features, and no one architecture has them all. Some of those unique features are more powerful than others.
Yes, we’re extremely pleased that people are finally beginning to see the game of chess we’ve been playing with the interrelationship of GCN, Mantle, DX12, Vulkan and LiquidVR.”
When somebody asked what are the aspects of DX12 that the FuryX is missing, Hallock replied and listed them.
“Raster Ordered Views and Conservative Raster. Thankfully, the techniques that these enable (like global illumination) can already be done in other ways at high framerates (see: DiRT Showdown).”
So it is simple, currently no graphics card with full 100% DirectX 12 support, that means that some games are to favor AMD and others Nvidia.
I want to add thing here, yesterday Hallock was all over this downplaying Nvidia and evangelizing how good their GPUs are, and now he is taking a step back with these answers on Reddit.
It's all marketing mud-fighting and attacking each other these days in-between Nvidia and AMD. Fun fact: on the AMD GPU Tech day for Fury, I myself literally confronted and asked about the DX12 supported feature levels to Hallock, and in this case Hallock himself absolutely refused to give a valid answer at the time as he very well knew that AMD would not fully support DX12 either.
airfathaaaaa
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#5151542 Posted on: 09/01/2015 09:57 AM
Infairness to AMD they showed the Fury as DX12 tier 2 (12_0) support so clearly it's not 100% DX12 compliant since it needs to be tier 3 (12_1) to be 100% compliant, i was kinda surprised that they didn't have it as tier 3 (12_1) but i guess they didn't want it to backfire if x doesn't work or perform like it should.
http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/amd-radeon-r9-fury-x-review,8.html
Which you can see here. So they have not advertised it as 100% compliant unlike their competitor.
http://international.download.nvidia.com/geforce-com/international/images/nvidia-geforce-gtx-980-ti/nvidia-geforce-gtx-980-ti-directx-12-advanced-api-support.png
i tought every cgn card has resource binding technology on them and thus they are fully tier 3 cards
Infairness to AMD they showed the Fury as DX12 tier 2 (12_0) support so clearly it's not 100% DX12 compliant since it needs to be tier 3 (12_1) to be 100% compliant, i was kinda surprised that they didn't have it as tier 3 (12_1) but i guess they didn't want it to backfire if x doesn't work or perform like it should.
http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/amd-radeon-r9-fury-x-review,8.html
Which you can see here. So they have not advertised it as 100% compliant unlike their competitor.
http://international.download.nvidia.com/geforce-com/international/images/nvidia-geforce-gtx-980-ti/nvidia-geforce-gtx-980-ti-directx-12-advanced-api-support.png
i tought every cgn card has resource binding technology on them and thus they are fully tier 3 cards
alanm
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#5151546 Posted on: 09/01/2015 10:10 AM
^ That table was discredited. Originally from wikipedia but some idiot kept editing the table to indicate pascal has no async shader. Was eventually deleted from wiki.
^ That table was discredited. Originally from wikipedia but some idiot kept editing the table to indicate pascal has no async shader. Was eventually deleted from wiki.
cyberfredxxx
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#5151549 Posted on: 09/01/2015 10:14 AM
it s the same with every new version of directx...
both actual card from AMD or Nvidia haven't full support of the new directx :/
We must wait the new generation to have full support.
it s the same with every new version of directx...
both actual card from AMD or Nvidia haven't full support of the new directx :/
We must wait the new generation to have full support.
airfathaaaaa
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#5151552 Posted on: 09/01/2015 10:23 AM
that much i know but given what we know now about maxwell 2.0 that table is pretty damn spot on
^ That table was discredited. Originally from wikipedia but some idiot kept editing the table to indicate pascal has no async shader. Was eventually deleted from wiki.
that much i know but given what we know now about maxwell 2.0 that table is pretty damn spot on
mitzi76
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#5151561 Posted on: 09/01/2015 10:37 AM
What did I say in the other thread?
Just ignore the junk from both sides. Sad they have to resort to petty crap. Or it's just trolls making **** up..and posting benchmarks and tables.
We seen it before. Hardly original.
What did I say in the other thread?
Just ignore the junk from both sides. Sad they have to resort to petty crap. Or it's just trolls making **** up..and posting benchmarks and tables.
We seen it before. Hardly original.
(.)(.)
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#5151562 Posted on: 09/01/2015 10:39 AM
wrong thread
wrong thread
Ryu5uzaku
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#5151568 Posted on: 09/01/2015 10:55 AM
Did someone think that current gpus would be fully dx12 capable ? I thought it is pretty clear that there are features missing here and there considering the fact that all of these gpus were pretty much made way before dx12 was done.
Did someone think that current gpus would be fully dx12 capable ? I thought it is pretty clear that there are features missing here and there considering the fact that all of these gpus were pretty much made way before dx12 was done.
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#5151572 Posted on: 09/01/2015 10:58 AM
This all pretty pathetic and just proves my point in regards to pc gamers being so hypocritical. Then theres the absolutely childish behaviour and utter delusion from a large portion of amd loyalist.
The competition has been leading they way for how long now and without question, still is, constantly leaving amd to play catch up.
Just one meaningless amd sponsored benchmark, the competitions lack of support for a feature that has been and still is of no real use on an api that is still meaningless until we have actual games, and you smell blood and this is how you act.
****ing disgraceful.
Have you read what you just said in context?
This all pretty pathetic and just proves my point in regards to pc gamers being so hypocritical. Then theres the absolutely childish behaviour and utter delusion from a large portion of amd loyalist.
The competition has been leading they way for how long now and without question, still is, constantly leaving amd to play catch up.
Just one meaningless amd sponsored benchmark, the competitions lack of support for a feature that has been and still is of no real use on an api that is still meaningless until we have actual games, and you smell blood and this is how you act.
****ing disgraceful.
Have you read what you just said in context?
mitzi76
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#5151575 Posted on: 09/01/2015 11:02 AM
Not quite sure what you mean think he has a point to be honest....
This whole dx12 things smacks of unsubstantiated claims and trolling then people jumping on the bandwagon thinking they can try and give credibility to what is most likely made up garbage.
There may be some issues but until dx12 is launched officially I could claim anything...
Wait are they trying to influence buying habits or its just petty "your gpu cant do this so there...my games are gonna get 5fps improvement over yrs".
or "my hair/dust particles are gonna look amazing".
Have you read what you just said in context?
Not quite sure what you mean think he has a point to be honest....
This whole dx12 things smacks of unsubstantiated claims and trolling then people jumping on the bandwagon thinking they can try and give credibility to what is most likely made up garbage.
There may be some issues but until dx12 is launched officially I could claim anything...
Wait are they trying to influence buying habits or its just petty "your gpu cant do this so there...my games are gonna get 5fps improvement over yrs".
or "my hair/dust particles are gonna look amazing".
(.)(.)
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#5151576 Posted on: 09/01/2015 11:05 AM
****, wrong thread. loooool.
Have you read what you just said in context?
****, wrong thread. loooool.
pharma
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#5151579 Posted on: 09/01/2015 11:07 AM
i tought every cgn card has resource binding technology on them and thus they are fully tier 3 cards
Lol ... noobs keep changing the chart. The primary DX12 feature level chart can be found at the link below and is modified daily by people in the field.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feature-levels-in-Direct3D
i tought every cgn card has resource binding technology on them and thus they are fully tier 3 cards
Lol ... noobs keep changing the chart. The primary DX12 feature level chart can be found at the link below and is modified daily by people in the field.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feature-levels-in-Direct3D
Webhiker
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#5151581 Posted on: 09/01/2015 11:09 AM
After reading this : https://www.reddit.com/r/nvidia/comments/3j5e9b/analysis-async-compute-is-it-true-nvidia-cant-do/ and running the DX12 async compute test program. I would say Maxwell can do async compute and do it well as long as the command list is below 31 (GCN can do 128 so that's the difference - but until 31 - 980 Ti is way faster)
After reading this : https://www.reddit.com/r/nvidia/comments/3j5e9b/analysis-async-compute-is-it-true-nvidia-cant-do/ and running the DX12 async compute test program. I would say Maxwell can do async compute and do it well as long as the command list is below 31 (GCN can do 128 so that's the difference - but until 31 - 980 Ti is way faster)
Teawithgrief
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#5151589 Posted on: 09/01/2015 11:20 AM
Nope. Lol?
Amd and nvidia is not comparable this time at ALL!
Amd came out and honestly explained everything and said about their own lacking features before anyone even went looking for them.
And amd isnt trying to spin their lack of a few features as an "advantage" now, or any time before.
Marketing and hyperbole from both sides.
Nope. Lol?
Amd and nvidia is not comparable this time at ALL!
Amd came out and honestly explained everything and said about their own lacking features before anyone even went looking for them.
And amd isnt trying to spin their lack of a few features as an "advantage" now, or any time before.
Fox2232
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#5151590 Posted on: 09/01/2015 11:22 AM
Lol ... noobs keep changing the chart. The primary DX12 feature level chart can be found at the link below and is modified daily by people in the field.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feature-levels-in-Direct3D
While this is inconvenient that some active fella changes it over again, he only adds stuff to it, and he is not altering originally present information.
He added Async shaders, cross-node sharing, UAVs at every stage, maximum sample count for UAV-only rendering, Logical Blend Operations.
Well, and he removed MS's reference. But checking what he added, they are mostly same for AMD and nV, so it does not look like he is taking sides.
(Tho, I would state for async shader on nV as partial, since it works. Just not as intended => may mean poor implementation.)
Lol ... noobs keep changing the chart. The primary DX12 feature level chart can be found at the link below and is modified daily by people in the field.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feature-levels-in-Direct3D
While this is inconvenient that some active fella changes it over again, he only adds stuff to it, and he is not altering originally present information.
He added Async shaders, cross-node sharing, UAVs at every stage, maximum sample count for UAV-only rendering, Logical Blend Operations.
Well, and he removed MS's reference. But checking what he added, they are mostly same for AMD and nV, so it does not look like he is taking sides.
(Tho, I would state for async shader on nV as partial, since it works. Just not as intended => may mean poor implementation.)
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you are naughty