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AMD Might Replace RX 500 Cards with RX Vega 28 and 32
There's some new chatter in the channels that AMD will be releasing an RX Vega 32 and 28 to replace the current 500 line. The cards would use the smaller Vega11 GPU.
This chatter is based on some RRA certificate spotting that wccftech noticed, coming from South Korea, where the new cards have been spotted. The names are RX Vega 32 and RX Vega 28, just multiply the numbers by 64 shader procs per cluster and you will notice that the cards have 2048 (Vega11 XT) and 1792 (Vega11 Pro) shader processors per card model.
Here's where the story gets weird, it is stated that the cards would be fitted with an expensive 4GB HBM2 chip. That means a 1024-bit wide memory bus. If correct, the products would battle the field where the GeForce GTX 1060 is active.
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AMD Might Bundle RGB LED coolers with Ryzen processors - 02/12/2017 02:17 PM
AMD is to release several SKUs for Ryzen, some of them with bundled cooler. Some new photos leaked onto the web, showing new RGB enabled coolers. ...
AMD might not release a hexacore Ryzen - 01/30/2017 10:29 AM
Alright, this is a bit of a speculative posting, however the thesis behind it sounds plausible. According to new rumors AMD will not release hexacore (6 core) processors or even dual-core processors. ...
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AMD might outsource chipset development to ASMedia - 06/06/2014 08:01 AM
DigiTimes noticed that AMD is likely to outsource its PC chipset R&D to ASMedia to save costs. Digitimes previously reported that AMD is planning to cooperate with ASMedia to integrate transmissio...
Kaarme
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#5475028 Posted on: 09/24/2017 09:57 AM
Considering how the current Vega cards are memory bandwidth starved due to cutting costs, this would only make sense if they used the same memory configuration for less powerful GPUs that need less bandwidth. Cutting the amount of memory in half seems so weird at this point I find it hard to believe.
Considering how the current Vega cards are memory bandwidth starved due to cutting costs, this would only make sense if they used the same memory configuration for less powerful GPUs that need less bandwidth. Cutting the amount of memory in half seems so weird at this point I find it hard to believe.
Dark Scizor
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#5475029 Posted on: 09/24/2017 09:59 AM
Sure, but this is only unofficial info at this point, can't determine their strategy from just that.
Sure, but this is only unofficial info at this point, can't determine their strategy from just that.
SalazarTennyson
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#5475033 Posted on: 09/24/2017 10:25 AM
Well, let me tell you something, Vega's Memory architecture is very powerful, needless to say. Sure, they are using HBM2 which is expensive but they've introduced a lot of other changes as well. They've basically made it so good, that at most, Vega actually needs 50% of vram compared to previous generations. I am not making this up. Raja Koduri himself said it during some interview. Also, since the bandwidth is so large, memory can be swapped in and out much faster, if needed.
Go home AMD, your drunk. Releasing a mid-range card that doesn't have more than 4gb of ram is nuts. It's going to be gimped like the gtx1060 3gb is.
Well, let me tell you something, Vega's Memory architecture is very powerful, needless to say. Sure, they are using HBM2 which is expensive but they've introduced a lot of other changes as well. They've basically made it so good, that at most, Vega actually needs 50% of vram compared to previous generations. I am not making this up. Raja Koduri himself said it during some interview. Also, since the bandwidth is so large, memory can be swapped in and out much faster, if needed.
Kaarme
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Posts: 1595
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#5475051 Posted on: 09/24/2017 11:57 AM
The bandwidth is not particularly large. Just look at the specs. It would have been huge if they had used more than two stacks, like Nvidia did in their pro card, but undoubtly due to cost issues AMD went for two stacks. It resulted in a bandwidth that is only similar to the original 1080Ti and less than the new 1080Ti version with faster memory.
Well, let me tell you something, Vega's Memory architecture is very powerful, needless to say. Sure, they are using HBM2 which is expensive but they've introduced a lot of other changes as well. They've basically made it so good, that at most, Vega actually needs 50% of vram compared to previous generations. I am not making this up. Raja Koduri himself said it during some interview. Also, since the bandwidth is so large, memory can be swapped in and out much faster, if needed.
The bandwidth is not particularly large. Just look at the specs. It would have been huge if they had used more than two stacks, like Nvidia did in their pro card, but undoubtly due to cost issues AMD went for two stacks. It resulted in a bandwidth that is only similar to the original 1080Ti and less than the new 1080Ti version with faster memory.
ObscureangelPT
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#5475053 Posted on: 09/24/2017 12:00 PM
@SalazarTennyson The GPU can be quick to swap assets, but you need to remember, that it swaps with the I/O HDD or SSDs, so even if the GPU is quick, the HDD or SSD will delay it anyway, aside if you use HBBC which consumes a lot of extra ram.
Considering how bad vega performs in IPC wise comparing to Fiji, they really need to come up with insane clock in order to even stay at the same level as the RX 500 series, since the RX 580 has 2308 Stream Processors.
I can even risk to say that this cards will be slower and more expensive than the RX 580, but probably with a much better power consumption.
For content creators like rendering 3D stuff and workstation work, probably it will be a steal option considering how well RX Vega performs.
Altough for gaming, I think it will be a disaster!
I'm curious.
Cheers
@SalazarTennyson The GPU can be quick to swap assets, but you need to remember, that it swaps with the I/O HDD or SSDs, so even if the GPU is quick, the HDD or SSD will delay it anyway, aside if you use HBBC which consumes a lot of extra ram.
Considering how bad vega performs in IPC wise comparing to Fiji, they really need to come up with insane clock in order to even stay at the same level as the RX 500 series, since the RX 580 has 2308 Stream Processors.
I can even risk to say that this cards will be slower and more expensive than the RX 580, but probably with a much better power consumption.
For content creators like rendering 3D stuff and workstation work, probably it will be a steal option considering how well RX Vega performs.
Altough for gaming, I think it will be a disaster!
I'm curious.
Cheers
sammarbella
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#5475069 Posted on: 09/24/2017 12:35 PM
The more efficient VRAM (less amount needed) HBM fairy tale was already told the previous iteration in Fury X vs 980 Ti and we know how it ended.
In real life (read: gaming performance) it showed little to no effect.
Well, let me tell you something, Vega's Memory architecture is very powerful, needless to say. Sure, they are using HBM2 which is expensive but they've introduced a lot of other changes as well. They've basically made it so good, that at most, Vega actually needs 50% of vram compared to previous generations. I am not making this up. Raja Koduri himself said it during some interview. Also, since the bandwidth is so large, memory can be swapped in and out much faster, if needed.
The more efficient VRAM (less amount needed) HBM fairy tale was already told the previous iteration in Fury X vs 980 Ti and we know how it ended.
In real life (read: gaming performance) it showed little to no effect.
Raider0001
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#5475074 Posted on: 09/24/2017 12:49 PM
The more efficient VRAM (less amount needed) HBM fairy tale was already told the previous iteration in Fury X vs 980 Ti and we know how it ended.
In real life (read: gaming performance) it showed little to no effect.
In real life yes, in reality HBM/2 is needed for optimising Radeons memory controller power consumption - and it still is much higher than GeForces. AMD should rework memory controller in the first place, but thats a bit harder as we see
Vega 32, 28 why ? AMD pricing needs a big time fix and availability...
The more efficient VRAM (less amount needed) HBM fairy tale was already told the previous iteration in Fury X vs 980 Ti and we know how it ended.
In real life (read: gaming performance) it showed little to no effect.
In real life yes, in reality HBM/2 is needed for optimising Radeons memory controller power consumption - and it still is much higher than GeForces. AMD should rework memory controller in the first place, but thats a bit harder as we see
Vega 32, 28 why ? AMD pricing needs a big time fix and availability...
Silva
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#5475079 Posted on: 09/24/2017 12:57 PM
Man, HBM2? I was hopping to buy this card because I couldn't get a RX570 but now I'm worried about the price...
Man, HBM2? I was hopping to buy this card because I couldn't get a RX570 but now I'm worried about the price...
airbud7
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Senior Member
Posts: 7261
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#5475081 Posted on: 09/24/2017 01:11 PM
If it can game like a 1060 at 1050ti price then its a winner....
If it can game like a 1060 at 1050ti price then its a winner....
Neo Cyrus
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Posts: 9197
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#5475089 Posted on: 09/24/2017 01:29 PM
Honestly, I don't even know if AMD is even attempting to aim for the gaming market anymore. Meanwhile, nVidia is laughing its ass off selling year old cards at a premium.
So if I want a GPU upgrade I can either:
1 - Get screwed by AMD and pay a fortune for sub-par performance.
2 - Get screwed by nVidia and pay a fortune for year old technology.
Sounds legit.
Honestly, I don't even know if AMD is even attempting to aim for the gaming market anymore. Meanwhile, nVidia is laughing its ass off selling year old cards at a premium.
So if I want a GPU upgrade I can either:
1 - Get screwed by AMD and pay a fortune for sub-par performance.
2 - Get screwed by nVidia and pay a fortune for year old technology.
Sounds legit.
Silva
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#5475102 Posted on: 09/24/2017 02:28 PM
If it can game like a 1060 at 1050ti price then its a winner....
If it doesn't beat them, AMD will have a hard time justifying the price due to HBM2.
Honestly, I don't even know if AMD is even attempting to aim for the gaming market anymore. Meanwhile, nVidia is laughing its ass off selling year old cards at a premium.
So if I want a GPU upgrade I can either:
1 - Get screwed by AMD and pay a fortune for sub-par performance.
2 - Get screwed by nVidia and pay a fortune for year old technology.
Sounds legit.
Vega has the performance (12,665 GFlops), it just failed at gaming (witch is the main selling factor).
And I was afraid they couldn't just swap the memory controller to be able to use GDDR5(X). I Guess Navi will be using HBM2/3? This will suck if AMD can't get performance closer to Nvidia.
AMD cards MSRP is actually fine, problem is this never ending mining craze...
It's not like you desperately need an upgrade, but the 1070Ti is a good deal. That or a discounted 1070.
If it can game like a 1060 at 1050ti price then its a winner....
If it doesn't beat them, AMD will have a hard time justifying the price due to HBM2.
Honestly, I don't even know if AMD is even attempting to aim for the gaming market anymore. Meanwhile, nVidia is laughing its ass off selling year old cards at a premium.
So if I want a GPU upgrade I can either:
1 - Get screwed by AMD and pay a fortune for sub-par performance.
2 - Get screwed by nVidia and pay a fortune for year old technology.
Sounds legit.
Vega has the performance (12,665 GFlops), it just failed at gaming (witch is the main selling factor).
And I was afraid they couldn't just swap the memory controller to be able to use GDDR5(X). I Guess Navi will be using HBM2/3? This will suck if AMD can't get performance closer to Nvidia.
AMD cards MSRP is actually fine, problem is this never ending mining craze...
It's not like you desperately need an upgrade, but the 1070Ti is a good deal. That or a discounted 1070.
cowie
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Posts: 13190
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#5475109 Posted on: 09/24/2017 02:45 PM
perfect for the new consoles
I hope these smaller chips don't need a 6+6 set up:p
perfect for the new consoles
I hope these smaller chips don't need a 6+6 set up:p
Neo Cyrus
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Posts: 9197
Joined: 2006-02-14
#5475112 Posted on: 09/24/2017 02:52 PM
If it doesn't beat them, AMD will have a hard time justifying the price due to HBM2.
Vega has the performance (12,665 GFlops), it just failed at gaming (witch is the main selling factor).
And I was afraid they couldn't just swap the memory controller to be able to use GDDR5(X). I Guess Navi will be using HBM2/3? This will suck if AMD can't get performance closer to Nvidia.
AMD cards MSRP is actually fine, problem is this never ending mining craze...
It's not like you desperately need an upgrade, but the 1070Ti is a good deal. That or a discounted 1070.
I'd be fine with this OC for a while longer if I played at 1080p, but I've almost never used that resolution. At 1440p a 970 falls just short or holding 60 fps in modern games with settings I would want (max textures and effects if possible), even at 1.6GHz (which is unstable lately so I turned it down, not sure if it's due to age/degradation, drivers, or both).
I don't know about their lower end cards but the MSRP for the cheapest Vega 64 I can find (here anyway) is retarded. $1005.7 ($890 + 13%) for the shitty blower fan reference card. That price is in 1080 Ti territory which is already inflated.
I'm sitting here wondering if it's really necessary to use HBM on a low-end card. It feels like the price is going to be shit because of it. A new memory controller must cost more than straight up using HBM, but I would bet the price is still going to bad for the gaming performance they will provide if Vega 64 is anything to go by.
If it doesn't beat them, AMD will have a hard time justifying the price due to HBM2.
Vega has the performance (12,665 GFlops), it just failed at gaming (witch is the main selling factor).
And I was afraid they couldn't just swap the memory controller to be able to use GDDR5(X). I Guess Navi will be using HBM2/3? This will suck if AMD can't get performance closer to Nvidia.
AMD cards MSRP is actually fine, problem is this never ending mining craze...
It's not like you desperately need an upgrade, but the 1070Ti is a good deal. That or a discounted 1070.
I'd be fine with this OC for a while longer if I played at 1080p, but I've almost never used that resolution. At 1440p a 970 falls just short or holding 60 fps in modern games with settings I would want (max textures and effects if possible), even at 1.6GHz (which is unstable lately so I turned it down, not sure if it's due to age/degradation, drivers, or both).
I don't know about their lower end cards but the MSRP for the cheapest Vega 64 I can find (here anyway) is retarded. $1005.7 ($890 + 13%) for the shitty blower fan reference card. That price is in 1080 Ti territory which is already inflated.
I'm sitting here wondering if it's really necessary to use HBM on a low-end card. It feels like the price is going to be shit because of it. A new memory controller must cost more than straight up using HBM, but I would bet the price is still going to bad for the gaming performance they will provide if Vega 64 is anything to go by.
SHS
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Posts: 432
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#5475115 Posted on: 09/24/2017 02:59 PM
Honestly, I don't even know if AMD is even attempting to aim for the gaming market anymore. Meanwhile, nVidia is laughing its ass off selling year old cards at a premium.
That could be true
So if I want a GPU upgrade I can either:
1 - Get screwed by AMD and pay a fortune for sub-par performance.
2 - Get screwed by nVidia and pay a fortune for year old technology.
Sounds legit.
1 - No it not sub-par performance your only look at DirectX 11 performance where DirectX 12 and Vulkan tell a diff story depend on the game.
2 - Well that may be partly true but that not where we are get screwed at it G-sync technology which paid out nose for on the monitor.
3 - Where really lays in get screwed is all those that are price gouging carp out cards even with nVidia card to but let hope this all changes or sale will take a big nose dive this holiday season.
Honestly, I don't even know if AMD is even attempting to aim for the gaming market anymore. Meanwhile, nVidia is laughing its ass off selling year old cards at a premium.
That could be true
So if I want a GPU upgrade I can either:
1 - Get screwed by AMD and pay a fortune for sub-par performance.
2 - Get screwed by nVidia and pay a fortune for year old technology.
Sounds legit.
1 - No it not sub-par performance your only look at DirectX 11 performance where DirectX 12 and Vulkan tell a diff story depend on the game.
2 - Well that may be partly true but that not where we are get screwed at it G-sync technology which paid out nose for on the monitor.
3 - Where really lays in get screwed is all those that are price gouging carp out cards even with nVidia card to but let hope this all changes or sale will take a big nose dive this holiday season.
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Go home AMD, your drunk. Releasing a mid-range card that doesn't have more than 4gb of ram is nuts. It's going to be gimped like the gtx1060 3gb is.