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AMD Announces RX 5000 Series Graphics processors at Computex - Demos RX 5700
As we all know NAVI is the new family of Radeon GPUs. NAVI is based on 7nm RDNA architecture (Radeon DNA). NAVI will be PCIe Express 4.0 compatible, has a new compute design, new cache-hierarchy and will be reducing latency, lower power. 1.25x perf per clock improvement and 1.5x better power consumption.
During the keynote speech AMD announced the and named the 7nm NAVI based graphics cards the Radeon RX 5000 series products. A card based on NAVI was shown in a live demo and compared against a GeForce RTX 2070 in a direct comparison with the Radeon RX 5700. Strange Brigade. The FPS looked about the same but was mentioned to be roughly 10% faster.
AMD considers Navi as a completely new architecture. No longer GCN, but RDNA. RDNA uses completely redesigned Compute Units, which should significantly increase per-clock performance and efficiency. This includes a new cache structure. The changes are expected to boost Vega's performance by at least 25 percent per cycle ("IPC") and increase efficiency (wattage) by at least 50 percent.
Raytracing was not mentioned in the presentation and the Navi cards do not seem to have any hardware support for it. According to AMD, the Navi architecture will serve as the foundation for video cards for gamers in the coming years. AMD has not yet published any specifications or prices for the cards in the RX 5000 series. The manufacturer will do this during the E3 game fair, via a live stream. AMD announces that NAVI will be launching in July. June 10th there will be a live stream with all details on products, specs and prices.
Navi will debut as Radeon RX 5000 series, with the Radeon RX 5700 series leading initially.
AMD Announces E3 Event & Livestream Unveiling New GamingTechnologies - 05/14/2019 03:11 PM
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AMD just announced the Radeon VII (seven / 7 aka 7nm). The product is based on 60 Compute units which means times 64 shaders per cluster is 3840 shader processor. That means this is a Vega 64 shrun...
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MonstroMart
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#5673432 Posted on: 05/27/2019 04:23 AM
It actually was slightly faster ~10% than the 2070. That being said Strange Brigade is heavily AMD favored.. this being a new architecture might change that but until I see another game I'm going to assume the card they showed will be around 2070 performance in other games.
Still pretty cool that it's a new architecture tho
What is interesting if true is the 1.5x better power consumption. Performance wise Vega was not that bad. I mean the Vega 56 was just as good as the 1070. The main problem was power consumption and temp (and selling at the same price as nVidia while releasing the card at a later date). If they can address the power consumption and release something in the neighbourhood of the 2080 and 2070 while undercutting nVidia (and forcing them to adjust the price) then i'll be more than happy.
It actually was slightly faster ~10% than the 2070. That being said Strange Brigade is heavily AMD favored.. this being a new architecture might change that but until I see another game I'm going to assume the card they showed will be around 2070 performance in other games.
Still pretty cool that it's a new architecture tho
What is interesting if true is the 1.5x better power consumption. Performance wise Vega was not that bad. I mean the Vega 56 was just as good as the 1070. The main problem was power consumption and temp (and selling at the same price as nVidia while releasing the card at a later date). If they can address the power consumption and release something in the neighbourhood of the 2080 and 2070 while undercutting nVidia (and forcing them to adjust the price) then i'll be more than happy.
__hollywood|meo
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#5673443 Posted on: 05/27/2019 04:41 AM
vega56 was better than the 1070 - thats entirely why nvidia released the 1070ti. but yes, power consumption was pretty damn bad for vega, even if undervolted
im half irritated that i have to wait until E3 for actual architecture & model-specific details, but its not that far away
vega56 was better than the 1070 - thats entirely why nvidia released the 1070ti. but yes, power consumption was pretty damn bad for vega, even if undervolted
im half irritated that i have to wait until E3 for actual architecture & model-specific details, but its not that far away
CPC_RedDawn
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#5673446 Posted on: 05/27/2019 04:45 AM
Didn't you guys see that PCIE4.0 3DMark benchmark????
69% better performance over a 2080Ti????
That can't be right, just from a bandwidth upgrade? Going from PCIE2.0 to PCIE3.0 wasn't much different, defo not 69%!??
Didn't you guys see that PCIE4.0 3DMark benchmark????
69% better performance over a 2080Ti????
That can't be right, just from a bandwidth upgrade? Going from PCIE2.0 to PCIE3.0 wasn't much different, defo not 69%!??
Denial
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#5673447 Posted on: 05/27/2019 04:46 AM
Didn't you guys see that PCIE4.0 3DMark benchmark????
69% better performance over a 2080Ti????
That can't be right, just from a bandwidth upgrade? Going from PCIE2.0 to PCIE3.0 wasn't much different, defo not 69%!??
It's a benchmark designed to saturate the pci-e bandwidth... there aren't going to be any games in the next 10 years that come close to doing that.
There have been synthetic examples of this with prior PCI-E specs.
Didn't you guys see that PCIE4.0 3DMark benchmark????
69% better performance over a 2080Ti????
That can't be right, just from a bandwidth upgrade? Going from PCIE2.0 to PCIE3.0 wasn't much different, defo not 69%!??
It's a benchmark designed to saturate the pci-e bandwidth... there aren't going to be any games in the next 10 years that come close to doing that.
There have been synthetic examples of this with prior PCI-E specs.
DW75
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#5673450 Posted on: 05/27/2019 04:48 AM
I guess we will see the Navi 58XX series in action on June 10th.
I guess we will see the Navi 58XX series in action on June 10th.
CPC_RedDawn
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#5673451 Posted on: 05/27/2019 04:49 AM
It's a benchmark designed to saturate the pci-e bandwidth... there aren't going to be any games in the next 10 years that come close to doing that.
There have been synthetic examples of this with prior PCI-E specs.
Yea I guessed as much, wish companies would just stop doing benchmarks that suit them. As soon as I saw Strange Brigade I was like "come on!!" with it being massively AMD favoured.
However, is this yet another AMD secret sauce? Maybe these chips will age like that good old AMD fine wine!??
It's a benchmark designed to saturate the pci-e bandwidth... there aren't going to be any games in the next 10 years that come close to doing that.
There have been synthetic examples of this with prior PCI-E specs.
Yea I guessed as much, wish companies would just stop doing benchmarks that suit them. As soon as I saw Strange Brigade I was like "come on!!" with it being massively AMD favoured.
However, is this yet another AMD secret sauce? Maybe these chips will age like that good old AMD fine wine!??
Picolete
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#5673457 Posted on: 05/27/2019 05:07 AM
Yea I guessed as much, wish companies would just stop doing benchmarks that suit them. As soon as I saw Strange Brigade I was like "come on!!" with it being massively AMD favoured.
However, is this yet another AMD secret sauce? Maybe these chips will age like that good old AMD fine wine!?? :p
Being their first GPU on this architecture i expect some improvements with future drivers even more for the ports of next gen games
Yea I guessed as much, wish companies would just stop doing benchmarks that suit them. As soon as I saw Strange Brigade I was like "come on!!" with it being massively AMD favoured.
However, is this yet another AMD secret sauce? Maybe these chips will age like that good old AMD fine wine!?? :p
Being their first GPU on this architecture i expect some improvements with future drivers even more for the ports of next gen games
UZ7
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#5673473 Posted on: 05/27/2019 05:38 AM
Didn't you guys see that PCIE4.0 3DMark benchmark????
69% better performance over a 2080Ti????
That can't be right, just from a bandwidth upgrade? Going from PCIE2.0 to PCIE3.0 wasn't much different, defo not 69%!??
They could be testing 2080Ti GDDR6 vs Navi HBM for bandwidth.
Didn't you guys see that PCIE4.0 3DMark benchmark????
69% better performance over a 2080Ti????
That can't be right, just from a bandwidth upgrade? Going from PCIE2.0 to PCIE3.0 wasn't much different, defo not 69%!??
They could be testing 2080Ti GDDR6 vs Navi HBM for bandwidth.
Vananovion
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#5673538 Posted on: 05/27/2019 08:53 AM
As far as I remember HBM was never mentioned for Navi, only GDDR6. Also the chip Lisa is holding doesn't appear to have HBM packages. Maybe we'll get Navi with HBM down the line, but it seems like the first run will be GDDR6.
They could be testing 2080Ti GDDR6 vs Navi HBM for bandwidth.
As far as I remember HBM was never mentioned for Navi, only GDDR6. Also the chip Lisa is holding doesn't appear to have HBM packages. Maybe we'll get Navi with HBM down the line, but it seems like the first run will be GDDR6.
Andy Watson
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#5673540 Posted on: 05/27/2019 09:02 AM
The new architecture will be interesting to learn about and the efficiency sounds interesting if it can deliver on watts and temps.
Always the big question is to be bang per buck. I'm guessing bargains are a thing of the past now at will all be positioning against nvidia.
Is this going to be GDDR6 and HBM depending on the model hierarchy?
The new architecture will be interesting to learn about and the efficiency sounds interesting if it can deliver on watts and temps.
Always the big question is to be bang per buck. I'm guessing bargains are a thing of the past now at will all be positioning against nvidia.
Is this going to be GDDR6 and HBM depending on the model hierarchy?
kings
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#5673560 Posted on: 05/27/2019 10:06 AM
Comparing the card on the best case scenario Strange Brigade... so, in general it probably means it will fall somewhere between RTX 2060 and RTX 2070...
Comparing the card on the best case scenario Strange Brigade... so, in general it probably means it will fall somewhere between RTX 2060 and RTX 2070...
Fox2232
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#5673585 Posted on: 05/27/2019 11:34 AM
They did run it on 1440p. Hilbert measured that Radeon VII has just 7.5% advantage over RTX 2080 there.
R-VII has on that resolution advantage of:
10% in BF5; -2.4% in SoTR; 5.4% in DX:MD; -3.8% in SW:BF2; -4.8% in FC5; -8.5% in F1(2018); -17.7% in Destiny2; -16.2% in TW3; -14% KC
eliverance;
-17.7% in GTA5; -14% in SoW;
If you look at it, you can see pattern of quite equal performance in shader heavy/technologically modern games. Why do you think that Radeon VII which is actually much stronger in pure shader brute force loses to RTX 2080 in some titles so badly?
it is due to geometry processing and rasterization limitations. While people had till today trouble understanding what Navi is. it would be good idea to think about AMD improving their two biggest weak points.
That means one could expect that shown GPU will outperform RTX 2070 on 1080p by higher margin as geometry performance is less important on 4K.
And Shading power is less important on lower resolution too.
From simple math I did in other thread, this shown GPU may as well be 2560SP chip. In that case check this.
RX-580 is total underdog in between modern GPUs in terms of rasterization. It has somewhat decent geometry processing. But it seems that AMD may have doubled front-end and back-end which would put such GPU in those two categories at around 2.4 times performance if we include move from around 1400MHz to 1700MHz range.
That would put rasterization at around 2060 level and geometry 20% above 2080. This could explain 2070 performance shown. And this means that at lower resolutions, nVidia would no longer keep its advantage. (Apparently shading would not be the best as AMD claims 25% improvement and 2560 is 11% above 2306 + 20% clock... 1.66x shading power at best above RX-580.)
While they did show 1440p comparison, I think they did hold back 1080p performance on purpose as that may bring some wows on E3. But in the end, price point and power draw will be decisive factor. And judging by Zen2 pricing, I think we are not going to be disappointed.
Comparing the card on the best case scenario Strange Brigade... so, in general it probably means it will fall somewhere between RTX 2060 and RTX 2070...
They did run it on 1440p. Hilbert measured that Radeon VII has just 7.5% advantage over RTX 2080 there.
R-VII has on that resolution advantage of:
10% in BF5; -2.4% in SoTR; 5.4% in DX:MD; -3.8% in SW:BF2; -4.8% in FC5; -8.5% in F1(2018); -17.7% in Destiny2; -16.2% in TW3; -14% KC
eliverance;-17.7% in GTA5; -14% in SoW;
If you look at it, you can see pattern of quite equal performance in shader heavy/technologically modern games. Why do you think that Radeon VII which is actually much stronger in pure shader brute force loses to RTX 2080 in some titles so badly?
it is due to geometry processing and rasterization limitations. While people had till today trouble understanding what Navi is. it would be good idea to think about AMD improving their two biggest weak points.
That means one could expect that shown GPU will outperform RTX 2070 on 1080p by higher margin as geometry performance is less important on 4K.
And Shading power is less important on lower resolution too.
From simple math I did in other thread, this shown GPU may as well be 2560SP chip. In that case check this.
RX-580 is total underdog in between modern GPUs in terms of rasterization. It has somewhat decent geometry processing. But it seems that AMD may have doubled front-end and back-end which would put such GPU in those two categories at around 2.4 times performance if we include move from around 1400MHz to 1700MHz range.
That would put rasterization at around 2060 level and geometry 20% above 2080. This could explain 2070 performance shown. And this means that at lower resolutions, nVidia would no longer keep its advantage. (Apparently shading would not be the best as AMD claims 25% improvement and 2560 is 11% above 2306 + 20% clock... 1.66x shading power at best above RX-580.)
While they did show 1440p comparison, I think they did hold back 1080p performance on purpose as that may bring some wows on E3. But in the end, price point and power draw will be decisive factor. And judging by Zen2 pricing, I think we are not going to be disappointed.
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#5673587 Posted on: 05/27/2019 11:46 AM
It's a benchmark designed to saturate the pci-e bandwidth... there aren't going to be any games in the next 10 years that come close to doing that.
There have been synthetic examples of this with prior PCI-E specs.
With single gpus*
Pcie 4.0 would very much be welcomed by sli users.
It's a benchmark designed to saturate the pci-e bandwidth... there aren't going to be any games in the next 10 years that come close to doing that.
There have been synthetic examples of this with prior PCI-E specs.
With single gpus*
Pcie 4.0 would very much be welcomed by sli users.
Mpampis
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#5673590 Posted on: 05/27/2019 11:47 AM
Well, I think near RTX 2070 performance, for about 400€ would be pretty good for 1080p/1440p using an 144Hz Freesync monitor.
If that's the case, I can see me replacing my RX480.
RTX 2070 does have RT cores though, so I think anything above 420€ isn't justified if the Navi card can't deliver that 10% performance bump.
Well, I think near RTX 2070 performance, for about 400€ would be pretty good for 1080p/1440p using an 144Hz Freesync monitor.
If that's the case, I can see me replacing my RX480.
RTX 2070 does have RT cores though, so I think anything above 420€ isn't justified if the Navi card can't deliver that 10% performance bump.
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It actually was slightly faster ~10% than the 2070. That being said Strange Brigade is heavily AMD favored.. this being a new architecture might change that but until I see another game I'm going to assume the card they showed will be around 2070 performance in other games.
Still pretty cool that it's a new architecture tho