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Wolfenstein II The New Colossus: PC graphics analysis benchmark review
Posted by: on: 11/05/2017 11:47 AM [
40 comment(s) ]
It's time to check out the PC release of Wolfenstein II The New Colossus for Windows relative towards graphics card performance with the latest AMD/NVIDIA graphics card drivers. Multiple graphics cards are being tested and benchmarked. We have a look at performance with the newest graphics cards and technologies.
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Turanis
Senior Member
Posts: 1301
Senior Member
Posts: 1301
Posted on: 11/06/2017 11:46 AM
On Ryzen+Radeon system I have not a single problem (well,only Alt+Tab in excess give a crash),everything on High+SMAA @ 1080p (17.10.3 driver),the game looks good,except some ugly flat textures.
On Gtx side will be problems because Vulkan+Async Compute.
@OnnA With Chill will lose some precious frames.
Not a bad game(Imo too much politics),but Wolfenstein The New Order+aclaimed Old Blood is much better.
On Ryzen+Radeon system I have not a single problem (well,only Alt+Tab in excess give a crash),everything on High+SMAA @ 1080p (17.10.3 driver),the game looks good,except some ugly flat textures.
On Gtx side will be problems because Vulkan+Async Compute.
@OnnA With Chill will lose some precious frames.
Not a bad game(Imo too much politics),but Wolfenstein The New Order+aclaimed Old Blood is much better.
Agonist
Senior Member
Posts: 2667
Senior Member
Posts: 2667
Posted on: 11/07/2017 02:49 AM
Vram mate, and they are starting to run out of grunt, while Polaris is really starting to shine.
Some of AMDs own cards are trash in this game (Fiji). Furyx is behind RX470 at all resolutions.
Vram mate, and they are starting to run out of grunt, while Polaris is really starting to shine.
alanm
Senior Member
Posts: 8097
Senior Member
Posts: 8097
Posted on: 11/07/2017 06:52 AM
Did you see the vram usage chart?
http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/wolfenstein-ii-the-new-colossus-pc-graphics-analysis-benchmark-review,6.html
At 1080p vram is not an issue for 4gb cards. A 4gb 570 is way ahead of FuryX at that res. Also bear in mind that FuryX is HBM with a massive 1024 bit bus and can handle far higher mem bandwidth than regular gddr5 cards.Yes Polaris is starting to shine while Fiji imo is undergoing the 'Kepler effect'. AMD driver team more focused on their newer cards is my take on it.
Vram mate, and they are starting to run out of grunt, while Polaris is really starting to shine.
Did you see the vram usage chart?
http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/wolfenstein-ii-the-new-colossus-pc-graphics-analysis-benchmark-review,6.html
At 1080p vram is not an issue for 4gb cards. A 4gb 570 is way ahead of FuryX at that res. Also bear in mind that FuryX is HBM with a massive 1024 bit bus and can handle far higher mem bandwidth than regular gddr5 cards.Yes Polaris is starting to shine while Fiji imo is undergoing the 'Kepler effect'. AMD driver team more focused on their newer cards is my take on it.
Guru01
Senior Member
Posts: 316
Senior Member
Posts: 316
Posted on: 11/07/2017 07:58 AM
This game definitely looks to be an AMD ATI game since I have never seen the Vega 64 come so close to the 1080 Ti. But it runs at 91FPS on my 1070, so i'm happy.
This game definitely looks to be an AMD ATI game since I have never seen the Vega 64 come so close to the 1080 Ti. But it runs at 91FPS on my 1070, so i'm happy.
Fox2232
Senior Member
Posts: 7629
Senior Member
Posts: 7629
Posted on: 11/07/2017 08:39 AM
Did you see the vram usage chart?
http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/wolfenstein-ii-the-new-colossus-pc-graphics-analysis-benchmark-review,6.html
At 1080p vram is not an issue for 4gb cards. A 4gb 570 is way ahead of FuryX at that res. Also bear in mind that FuryX is HBM with a massive 1024 bit bus and can handle far higher mem bandwidth than regular gddr5 cards.Yes Polaris is starting to shine while Fiji imo is undergoing the 'Kepler effect'. AMD driver team more focused on their newer cards is my take on it.
It is not Kepler effect. Kepler effect means that card was left behind. (Mind that nVidia tried it several times with huge discrepancies in performance and delivered fixes upon community getting angry.)
There are some important changes in Polaris and then Vega. Pre-NCU GPUs are more wasteful in certain situations.
Initially Vega 64 was worse than Fury X in Clock-to-Clock comparison. But with modern content, situation differs.
Yes AMD can do extra optimizations for Fury X here and maybe it will catch up to RX 580. But even at launch of Polaris, certain workloads run like 20% slower on Fury X. If game has a lot of those, then Fury X with that massive 4096SP waits for those other workloads to finish and has no chance to perform at level of RX 580.
Did you see the vram usage chart?
http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/wolfenstein-ii-the-new-colossus-pc-graphics-analysis-benchmark-review,6.html
At 1080p vram is not an issue for 4gb cards. A 4gb 570 is way ahead of FuryX at that res. Also bear in mind that FuryX is HBM with a massive 1024 bit bus and can handle far higher mem bandwidth than regular gddr5 cards.Yes Polaris is starting to shine while Fiji imo is undergoing the 'Kepler effect'. AMD driver team more focused on their newer cards is my take on it.
It is not Kepler effect. Kepler effect means that card was left behind. (Mind that nVidia tried it several times with huge discrepancies in performance and delivered fixes upon community getting angry.)
There are some important changes in Polaris and then Vega. Pre-NCU GPUs are more wasteful in certain situations.
Initially Vega 64 was worse than Fury X in Clock-to-Clock comparison. But with modern content, situation differs.
Yes AMD can do extra optimizations for Fury X here and maybe it will catch up to RX 580. But even at launch of Polaris, certain workloads run like 20% slower on Fury X. If game has a lot of those, then Fury X with that massive 4096SP waits for those other workloads to finish and has no chance to perform at level of RX 580.
senniha1994
Junior Member
Posts: 5
Junior Member
Posts: 5
Posted on: 11/07/2017 06:18 PM
Of course their is a problem with Vram in Fury x at 1080p.At Mein leben i get from 4.7 gb to 5.8 gb in average in most places and almost 7.9 gb in other.If reviewer search the setting the you easy find that Fury is hammered by image streaming above medium settings.Its cache pool that has nothing to do with quality settings.I set all Settings Ulta/uber except Shadows "ultra" and image streaming "medium" and my vram was at 3.8gb.With this setting Fury will be in gtx1070 level performance.RETEST NORMAL and everything will be in the right order.
Of course their is a problem with Vram in Fury x at 1080p.At Mein leben i get from 4.7 gb to 5.8 gb in average in most places and almost 7.9 gb in other.If reviewer search the setting the you easy find that Fury is hammered by image streaming above medium settings.Its cache pool that has nothing to do with quality settings.I set all Settings Ulta/uber except Shadows "ultra" and image streaming "medium" and my vram was at 3.8gb.With this setting Fury will be in gtx1070 level performance.RETEST NORMAL and everything will be in the right order.
JonasBeckman
Senior Member
Posts: 14578
Senior Member
Posts: 14578
Posted on: 11/08/2017 09:43 AM
A low cache will restrict texture quality though you have to gimp it pretty heavily to affect things dramatically instead of having the game slowly fade in/out as it manages data.
https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4564/24388003648-9c88c9837b-o.jpg
https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4577/37548283654-1bc4ce1934-o.jpg
First image is with a is_poolsize value of 128, textures just can not load, 512 - 1024 works most of the time though but with more noticeable fade in and transitions between quality levels.
Second image is a full on 6144 or 1.5x 4096, higher isn't possible without the game refusing to load up the main menu at start so that's the limit until I can get a 8 GB GPU whenever. :p
Textures are sharp and stay sharp, framerate goes straight down of course and it doesn't take much for things to go really poorly for the GPU because there's no way it can cope with the cache being so high ha ha.
Even slightly improves gun detail in this comparison but not by much, certainly nowhere near what the promo images showcase and NPC faces are also curiously low detail even for more major actors.
EDIT: There are different systems in play though, image_ related settings and cvars affect some textures, vt_ related cvars and such affect a few other things and then there's these is_ settings for streaming affecting some things too.
The game loves VRAM though, a 12 GB Titan or full on 16 GB Vega Frontier/Pro would be fun to see just how much you can increase these settings by without running into VRAM issues or artifacts from trying to push texture detail from 8192x8192 pages to full 16384x16384 and possibly even remove some of the compression settings.
(Nothing going to do much if the source assets themselves are a bit lower quality of course, can only make small improvements which might explain gun and face texture blurriness.)
A low cache will restrict texture quality though you have to gimp it pretty heavily to affect things dramatically instead of having the game slowly fade in/out as it manages data.
https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4564/24388003648-9c88c9837b-o.jpg
https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4577/37548283654-1bc4ce1934-o.jpg
First image is with a is_poolsize value of 128, textures just can not load, 512 - 1024 works most of the time though but with more noticeable fade in and transitions between quality levels.
Second image is a full on 6144 or 1.5x 4096, higher isn't possible without the game refusing to load up the main menu at start so that's the limit until I can get a 8 GB GPU whenever. :p
Textures are sharp and stay sharp, framerate goes straight down of course and it doesn't take much for things to go really poorly for the GPU because there's no way it can cope with the cache being so high ha ha.
Even slightly improves gun detail in this comparison but not by much, certainly nowhere near what the promo images showcase and NPC faces are also curiously low detail even for more major actors.
EDIT: There are different systems in play though, image_ related settings and cvars affect some textures, vt_ related cvars and such affect a few other things and then there's these is_ settings for streaming affecting some things too.
The game loves VRAM though, a 12 GB Titan or full on 16 GB Vega Frontier/Pro would be fun to see just how much you can increase these settings by without running into VRAM issues or artifacts from trying to push texture detail from 8192x8192 pages to full 16384x16384 and possibly even remove some of the compression settings.
(Nothing going to do much if the source assets themselves are a bit lower quality of course, can only make small improvements which might explain gun and face texture blurriness.)
xxela
Senior Member
Posts: 213
Senior Member
Posts: 213
Posted on: 11/10/2017 03:20 PM
Fury has some problem (probably vram related) with just one setting TSSAA (8TX). When applied GPU usage drops and also the frames. There is more than 20 fps difference between Mein leben! - TSSAA (8TX) preset and Mein leben! - SMAA (1TX).
1080p Mein leben! - TSSAA (8TX)
1080p Mein leben! - SMAA (1TX)
So if lowering one setting on a 2 year old GPU is a
Fury has some problem (probably vram related) with just one setting TSSAA (8TX). When applied GPU usage drops and also the frames. There is more than 20 fps difference between Mein leben! - TSSAA (8TX) preset and Mein leben! - SMAA (1TX).
1080p Mein leben! - TSSAA (8TX)
1080p Mein leben! - SMAA (1TX)
So if lowering one setting on a 2 year old GPU is a
disaster
and make the card "trash" I take this trash gladly.
JonasBeckman
Senior Member
Posts: 14578
Senior Member
Posts: 14578
Posted on: 11/10/2017 08:19 PM
Memory limit I'm guessing but I have noticed TSSAA is pretty demanding, it's not quite the same as full on super sampling and from my understanding TSSAA 8x would take the eight previous frames into consideration for it's final image and calculation, using the r_antialiasing console commands this can be fine tuned a little bit though I wonder if keeping the info from those past 8 frames around for doing these calculations is too much for the Fury GPU, memory limit perhaps but could be some other bottleneck entirely.
Memory limit I'm guessing but I have noticed TSSAA is pretty demanding, it's not quite the same as full on super sampling and from my understanding TSSAA 8x would take the eight previous frames into consideration for it's final image and calculation, using the r_antialiasing console commands this can be fine tuned a little bit though I wonder if keeping the info from those past 8 frames around for doing these calculations is too much for the Fury GPU, memory limit perhaps but could be some other bottleneck entirely.
alanm
Senior Member
Posts: 8097
Senior Member
Posts: 8097
Posted on: 11/10/2017 08:40 PM
Would not be surprised if in weeks or months newer drivers significantly improve its performance.
Memory limit I'm guessing but I have noticed TSSAA is pretty demanding, it's not quite the same as full on super sampling and from my understanding TSSAA 8x would take the eight previous frames into consideration for it's final image and calculation, using the r_antialiasing console commands this can be fine tuned a little bit though I wonder if keeping the info from those past 8 frames around for doing these calculations is too much for the Fury GPU, memory limit perhaps but could be some other bottleneck entirely.
Would not be surprised if in weeks or months newer drivers significantly improve its performance.
kiss4luna
Junior Member
Posts: 16
Junior Member
Posts: 16
Posted on: 12/04/2017 07:05 PM
I think the reason that people are upset and I can only speak for myself, is that the game goes to great lengths to conflate white Americans with neo-nazis. Although I don't support Trump, some people have taken the position that a white American who does support Trump is automatically an "alt-right neo-nazi." As far as I know, this is new territory for Wolfenstein. You see, the picture they are trying to paint is that your typical White American would roll over and love their new Nazi leaders if they had taken over. This was taken from The Verge, emphasis is mine.
"Blazkowicz’s father, a once-struggling Texas businessman who seethes with a familiar strain of angry white masculinity, is Wolfenstein’s archetypal American collaborator. A cruel and bigoted domestic abuser who thrives under the Nazi regime, he marries a Jewish woman for her money, beats her for protecting their son, and later hands her over to the Nazis. During an interactive flashback, he forces a young Blazkowicz — and by extension, the player — to shoot his own dog as punishment for befriending a black girl."
I don't know about you, but this certainly doesn't describe me, although I personally experienced strangers attempting to fit me into their hateful mold.
What is most angering about all this neo-nazi talk and Trump not condemning or condemning them too slowly is that it really is a moot point. Why is it a moot point? Because the American government brought 1000's of actual nazi scientists into the USA after WW2 and gave them comfy government jobs and didn't punish them at all. No, we said as long as they do their inhuman research for us then we are okay with it. It's called Operation Paperclip and it's documented fact, but you'll never hear about that. You'll never hear about the horrifying research that was done in the name of "science" or where NASA came from.
While I understand that this is a tech forum, this particular videogame is hammering on a particular group of people(White Americans, not Neo-Nazis) that happens to makeup a large part of it's intended market. So, I do believe it's a valid discussion in that regard. When Machinegames and Bethesda stop making politicized games, then we can go back to non-politicized tech forums.
I agree with Frances, too much politics in this game and it makes me not very comfortable for "rendering all whites to Nazis". It's sort of like "All Chinese are dog-eating creeps" or worse. TNO and the TOB are much better in story telling IMHO.
And how did you guys get the frametime data from this game? I just found out PresentMon not working in this game.
I think the reason that people are upset and I can only speak for myself, is that the game goes to great lengths to conflate white Americans with neo-nazis. Although I don't support Trump, some people have taken the position that a white American who does support Trump is automatically an "alt-right neo-nazi." As far as I know, this is new territory for Wolfenstein. You see, the picture they are trying to paint is that your typical White American would roll over and love their new Nazi leaders if they had taken over. This was taken from The Verge, emphasis is mine.
"Blazkowicz’s father, a once-struggling Texas businessman who seethes with a familiar strain of angry white masculinity, is Wolfenstein’s archetypal American collaborator. A cruel and bigoted domestic abuser who thrives under the Nazi regime, he marries a Jewish woman for her money, beats her for protecting their son, and later hands her over to the Nazis. During an interactive flashback, he forces a young Blazkowicz — and by extension, the player — to shoot his own dog as punishment for befriending a black girl."
I don't know about you, but this certainly doesn't describe me, although I personally experienced strangers attempting to fit me into their hateful mold.
What is most angering about all this neo-nazi talk and Trump not condemning or condemning them too slowly is that it really is a moot point. Why is it a moot point? Because the American government brought 1000's of actual nazi scientists into the USA after WW2 and gave them comfy government jobs and didn't punish them at all. No, we said as long as they do their inhuman research for us then we are okay with it. It's called Operation Paperclip and it's documented fact, but you'll never hear about that. You'll never hear about the horrifying research that was done in the name of "science" or where NASA came from.
While I understand that this is a tech forum, this particular videogame is hammering on a particular group of people(White Americans, not Neo-Nazis) that happens to makeup a large part of it's intended market. So, I do believe it's a valid discussion in that regard. When Machinegames and Bethesda stop making politicized games, then we can go back to non-politicized tech forums.
I agree with Frances, too much politics in this game and it makes me not very comfortable for "rendering all whites to Nazis". It's sort of like "All Chinese are dog-eating creeps" or worse. TNO and the TOB are much better in story telling IMHO.
And how did you guys get the frametime data from this game? I just found out PresentMon not working in this game.
D3M1G0D
Senior Member
Posts: 1197
Senior Member
Posts: 1197
Posted on: 12/04/2017 09:08 PM
Is BJ not white? How about Anya, Super Spesh, Wyatt or Fergus? How about the many miscellaneous characters in the sub, many of whom are white? Where exactly do you get the idea that the game is "rendering all whites to Nazis"?
I agree with Frances, too much politics in this game and it makes me not very comfortable for "rendering all whites to Nazis". It's sort of like "All Chinese are dog-eating creeps" or worse. TNO and the TOB are much better in story telling IMHO.
Is BJ not white? How about Anya, Super Spesh, Wyatt or Fergus? How about the many miscellaneous characters in the sub, many of whom are white? Where exactly do you get the idea that the game is "rendering all whites to Nazis"?
StewieTech
Chuck Norris
Posts: 2525
Chuck Norris
Posts: 2525
Posted on: 12/04/2017 10:46 PM
Hey Hilbert, thanks!
Its always good to kill nazis in videogames. Its as wrong as a cup of warm tea on a cold winter afternoon. Hell, you could drown them in their own piss it would still be apropriate! They´re nazis...
Hey Hilbert, thanks!
Its always good to kill nazis in videogames. Its as wrong as a cup of warm tea on a cold winter afternoon. Hell, you could drown them in their own piss it would still be apropriate! They´re nazis...
kiss4luna
Junior Member
Posts: 16
Junior Member
Posts: 16
Posted on: 12/05/2017 03:48 AM
I understand what you mean, but it's hard for me to describe the feeling in this game.
I personally was born in a "totalitarian" country and I'm still living in it now. When the government wants to eliminate you, no matter you really did something or not, you just "did" it and you have no way to get a lawyer. When BJ has a lawyer visiting him in the jail, it just looks very fake. I and many people around me just know it, as a political prisoner, you never get a lawyer. Search for Xiaobo Liu if you want to know more, and there are many cases like this.
The problem is, imo, the developers never had experience living in a real "Nazi" world or totalitarian society, many details and many plots are too fake for people who are still living in a totalitarian country like me. It's like people living in the "Brave New World" (by Aldous Huxley) wants to draw a picture of the world of "1984" (by George Orwell) and of course they just can't do it correctly because it's unimaginable to them.
I have to apologize in advance if I triggered any uncomfortable feeling cause everybody outside of the United States and Europe knows the political tendance is a little bit too "left". And no matter it's left or right they both are "right" in my country where people usually get trouble for being "right". And in the past 60 years there were millions of people died for being "right" or being accused of being "right" in my country. We indeed know much better what totalitarianism is than the developers.
Nazis, Commies, they are the same. But in the Wolfenstein II, the developers obviously made something wrong, they somehow praise the Commies in order to oppose the Nazis. No, it's not right at all. The Commie is more evil than the Nazis, and this is the part the developers totally get it wrong in the game. I say again, NO COMMIES.
I'm sorry for being such political in this tech thread, and I came here searching for the solution of not being able to grab frametime data from Wolfenstein II.
Sorry.
Is BJ not white? How about Anya, Super Spesh, Wyatt or Fergus? How about the many miscellaneous characters in the sub, many of whom are white? Where exactly do you get the idea that the game is "rendering all whites to Nazis"?
I understand what you mean, but it's hard for me to describe the feeling in this game.
I personally was born in a "totalitarian" country and I'm still living in it now. When the government wants to eliminate you, no matter you really did something or not, you just "did" it and you have no way to get a lawyer. When BJ has a lawyer visiting him in the jail, it just looks very fake. I and many people around me just know it, as a political prisoner, you never get a lawyer. Search for Xiaobo Liu if you want to know more, and there are many cases like this.
The problem is, imo, the developers never had experience living in a real "Nazi" world or totalitarian society, many details and many plots are too fake for people who are still living in a totalitarian country like me. It's like people living in the "Brave New World" (by Aldous Huxley) wants to draw a picture of the world of "1984" (by George Orwell) and of course they just can't do it correctly because it's unimaginable to them.
I have to apologize in advance if I triggered any uncomfortable feeling cause everybody outside of the United States and Europe knows the political tendance is a little bit too "left". And no matter it's left or right they both are "right" in my country where people usually get trouble for being "right". And in the past 60 years there were millions of people died for being "right" or being accused of being "right" in my country. We indeed know much better what totalitarianism is than the developers.
Nazis, Commies, they are the same. But in the Wolfenstein II, the developers obviously made something wrong, they somehow praise the Commies in order to oppose the Nazis. No, it's not right at all. The Commie is more evil than the Nazis, and this is the part the developers totally get it wrong in the game. I say again, NO COMMIES.
I'm sorry for being such political in this tech thread, and I came here searching for the solution of not being able to grab frametime data from Wolfenstein II.
Sorry.
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Senior Member
Posts: 6133
1440p Mein Leben (Shadows on Ultra tho) TSSAAx8
ACE On
Deffered Off
Culing On
Blurrrr Off
Solid Brutal Performance 45-62 All't'time (CHill is set to 45-62)
Razor-Sharp Gameplay (similar to BF4/1)