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NVIDIA Kepler not fully compliant with DirectX 11.1
Posted by Hilbert Hagedoorn on: 11/23/2012 08:37 AM | 37 comment(s) ]
After a discussion on a German a website, NVIDIA confirmed that the Geforce 600 series does not fully support DirectX 11.1 aka is 100% compatible. Well, it doesn't fully support the API. The GTX 680 supports DirectX 11.1 with hardware API eature level 11.0, including all optional features.
Now that does include a number of features useful for game developers such as ...
Reply directly from NVIDIA:
- Partial constant buffer updates
- Logic operations in the Output Merger
- 16bpp rendering
- UAV-only rendering
- Partial clears
- Large constant buffers
We did not enable four non-gaming features in Hardware in Kepler (for 11_1):
- Target-Independent Rasterization (2D rendering only)
- 16xMSAA Rasterization (2D rendering only)
- Orthogonal Line Rendering Mode
- UAV in non-pixel-shader stages
So basically, NVIDIA does support 11.1 features with 11_0 feature level through the DirectX 11.1 API.
"We do not support feature level 11_1. This is a bit confusing, due to Microsoft naming. So we do support 11.1 from a feature level for gaming related features."
The competitions AMD's Radeon HD 7000 "Southern Islands" GPU series is fully compliant with DirectX 11.1 (except the rebranded products from the 6000 family).
NVIDIA Kepler real-time raytracing demo at GTC 2012 - 05/17/2012 09:55 AM
There is no doubt that real-time raytracing and global illumination are 'the future' of gaming graphics. Enjoy the video. ...
NVIDIA Kepler GK107 Performance Exposed ? - 02/28/2012 01:36 PM
The chaps over at wccftech noticed that
AMD Radeon HD 7800 in March, NVIDIA Kepler in April - 02/17/2012 12:07 PM
Sources at graphics card makers told DigiTimes that AMD plans to release its Radeon HD 7870 and Radeon HD 7850 in the first half of March, while NVIDIA is set to introduce its Kepler GPUS in April: Al...
NVIDIA Kepler lineup Exposed ? - 02/07/2012 12:15 PM
Expreview found leaked details about NVIDIA's upcoming Kepler family. According to the rumors, NVIDIA has three new chips, the GK110, GK104 and GK106. Click on the thumbnail for the overview. In spi...
NVIDIA Kepler Is On Track is sampled - 12/14/2011 12:55 PM
Funny that when one Manufacturer is getting news (AMD R7000) that all of the sudden the competition becomes active with little news items as well. AMD will most certainly be the first graphics card ma...
Mikedogg
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#4461168 Posted on: 11/23/2012 08:50 AM
Lol your spelling mistakes have been somewhat epic lately.
But it makes sense, the "Kepler" architecture is not even stated as being DX11.1 complaint. But I'm sure many will hope it will be; not that I can see much coming from it besides "Native 3D."
Lol your spelling mistakes have been somewhat epic lately.
But it makes sense, the "Kepler" architecture is not even stated as being DX11.1 complaint. But I'm sure many will hope it will be; not that I can see much coming from it besides "Native 3D."
Spets
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#4461180 Posted on: 11/23/2012 09:09 AM
Stuff we won't see in games, makes sense.
Stuff we won't see in games, makes sense.
Darren Hodgson
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#4461183 Posted on: 11/23/2012 09:11 AM
If I'm reading that right it means that Kepler supports DX11.1 in the same way that DX11 supports DX10 graphics cards by virtue of being backward compatible. So any DX11.1 games would simply run as DX11 on Kepler cards even though MSI Afterburner (or whatever) would show DX11.1.
I can't say I'm bothered personally as I don't believe many games will use DX11.1 anyway and, if they do, then by that time new NVIDIA cards will be out and I'll have upgraded again anyway. As far as stereoscopic 3D goes, I cannot see it properly so I would never be interested in DX11.1 for that reason either.
If I'm reading that right it means that Kepler supports DX11.1 in the same way that DX11 supports DX10 graphics cards by virtue of being backward compatible. So any DX11.1 games would simply run as DX11 on Kepler cards even though MSI Afterburner (or whatever) would show DX11.1.
I can't say I'm bothered personally as I don't believe many games will use DX11.1 anyway and, if they do, then by that time new NVIDIA cards will be out and I'll have upgraded again anyway. As far as stereoscopic 3D goes, I cannot see it properly so I would never be interested in DX11.1 for that reason either.
(.)(.)
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#4461189 Posted on: 11/23/2012 09:19 AM
yeah 3d gaming and it performance hit = just another way for you to feel shafted by the fact that your $1000+ gpu is inadequate.
yeah 3d gaming and it performance hit = just another way for you to feel shafted by the fact that your $1000+ gpu is inadequate.
chanw4
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#4461193 Posted on: 11/23/2012 09:29 AM
at least its nothing like DX10.1 and DX10.0 (hopefully). Lots of game are still using DX9 anyway.
at least its nothing like DX10.1 and DX10.0 (hopefully). Lots of game are still using DX9 anyway.
Lane
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#4461291 Posted on: 11/23/2012 12:57 PM
Lol your spelling mistakes have been somewhat epic lately.
But it makes sense, the "Kepler" architecture is not even stated as being DX11.1 complaint. But I'm sure many will hope it will be; not that I can see much coming from it besides "Native 3D."
you are sure ?
its even in there page presentation of Kepler, and specially about the interview when Kepler was launched when they was asked about the bug in driver/card id who was showing DX11.0 only
http://pressroom.nvidia.com/easyir/customrel.do?easyirid=A0D622CE9F579F09&version=live&releasejsp=release_157&xhtml=true&prid=865433
Manufactured on TSMC's new 28-nm process, with support for PCI-E Gen 3 and DX11.1
Murrokapetii http://muropaketti.com/artikkelit/naytonohjaimet/nvidia-geforce-gtx-680-gk104
we also had to ask specifically whether the GK104 GPU with DirectX 11.1 support. The answer is yes, but NVIDIA's Drew Henry (General Manager for NVIDIA GPU's PC Business Unit), the "Who cares?"
( this is not really important for me what features are supported on hardware or software and marketing is marketing.. threre's no drama to make about this )..
Lol your spelling mistakes have been somewhat epic lately.
But it makes sense, the "Kepler" architecture is not even stated as being DX11.1 complaint. But I'm sure many will hope it will be; not that I can see much coming from it besides "Native 3D."
you are sure ?
its even in there page presentation of Kepler, and specially about the interview when Kepler was launched when they was asked about the bug in driver/card id who was showing DX11.0 only
http://pressroom.nvidia.com/easyir/customrel.do?easyirid=A0D622CE9F579F09&version=live&releasejsp=release_157&xhtml=true&prid=865433
Manufactured on TSMC's new 28-nm process, with support for PCI-E Gen 3 and DX11.1
Murrokapetii http://muropaketti.com/artikkelit/naytonohjaimet/nvidia-geforce-gtx-680-gk104
we also had to ask specifically whether the GK104 GPU with DirectX 11.1 support. The answer is yes, but NVIDIA's Drew Henry (General Manager for NVIDIA GPU's PC Business Unit), the "Who cares?"
( this is not really important for me what features are supported on hardware or software and marketing is marketing.. threre's no drama to make about this )..
Lane
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#4461295 Posted on: 11/23/2012 01:02 PM
If I'm reading that right it means that Kepler supports DX11.1 in the same way that DX11 supports DX10 graphics cards by virtue of being backward compatible. So any DX11.1 games would simply run as DX11 on Kepler cards even though MSI Afterburner (or whatever) would show DX11.1.
I can't say I'm bothered personally as I don't believe many games will use DX11.1 anyway and, if they do, then by that time new NVIDIA cards will be out and I'll have upgraded again anyway. As far as stereoscopic 3D goes, I cannot see it properly so I would never be interested in DX11.1 for that reason either.
In reality, Kepler only support DX11.1 features who can be used by the API on DX11_0 hardware level. All DX11.1 parts who are not supported by API and need specially hardware for it, are not supported by kepler
If you look the table on MSDN about DX level features, on the DX11.0 column, the DX11.1 features writed "optional1 " ( mean can be supported by API level DX11.1 runtime ) are supported by Kepler, but if you look the column of DX11.1 hardware, all features who require to be DX11.1 on hardware level, are note supported.. ( UAV on all stage ( used as feature like tesselation ), TIR ( can used on deferred rendering features for allow the use of different resolution table ).
Yet again, DX11.1 features level is not used yet, so.. no drama there.
If I'm reading that right it means that Kepler supports DX11.1 in the same way that DX11 supports DX10 graphics cards by virtue of being backward compatible. So any DX11.1 games would simply run as DX11 on Kepler cards even though MSI Afterburner (or whatever) would show DX11.1.
I can't say I'm bothered personally as I don't believe many games will use DX11.1 anyway and, if they do, then by that time new NVIDIA cards will be out and I'll have upgraded again anyway. As far as stereoscopic 3D goes, I cannot see it properly so I would never be interested in DX11.1 for that reason either.
In reality, Kepler only support DX11.1 features who can be used by the API on DX11_0 hardware level. All DX11.1 parts who are not supported by API and need specially hardware for it, are not supported by kepler
If you look the table on MSDN about DX level features, on the DX11.0 column, the DX11.1 features writed "optional1 " ( mean can be supported by API level DX11.1 runtime ) are supported by Kepler, but if you look the column of DX11.1 hardware, all features who require to be DX11.1 on hardware level, are note supported.. ( UAV on all stage ( used as feature like tesselation ), TIR ( can used on deferred rendering features for allow the use of different resolution table ).
Yet again, DX11.1 features level is not used yet, so.. no drama there.
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#4461370 Posted on: 11/23/2012 02:39 PM
I wouldn't lose any sleep over it, bring on the 780 I will buy it
I wouldn't lose any sleep over it, bring on the 780 I will buy it
Mikedogg
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#4461395 Posted on: 11/23/2012 03:18 PM
you are sure ?
its even in there page presentation of Kepler, and specially about the interview when Kepler was launched when they was asked about the bug in driver/card id who was showing DX11.0 only
http://pressroom.nvidia.com/easyir/customrel.do?easyirid=A0D622CE9F579F09&version=live&releasejsp=release_157&xhtml=true&prid=865433
It mentions DX11 not 11.1, and the Kepler 'Whitepaper" doesn't mention 11.1 either. www.geforce.com/Active/en_US/en_US/pdf/GeForce-GTX-680-Whitepaper-FINAL.pdf
Not that any of that matters, it just means they will have to implement it on a software level.
you are sure ?
its even in there page presentation of Kepler, and specially about the interview when Kepler was launched when they was asked about the bug in driver/card id who was showing DX11.0 only
http://pressroom.nvidia.com/easyir/customrel.do?easyirid=A0D622CE9F579F09&version=live&releasejsp=release_157&xhtml=true&prid=865433
It mentions DX11 not 11.1, and the Kepler 'Whitepaper" doesn't mention 11.1 either. www.geforce.com/Active/en_US/en_US/pdf/GeForce-GTX-680-Whitepaper-FINAL.pdf
Not that any of that matters, it just means they will have to implement it on a software level.
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#4461419 Posted on: 11/23/2012 03:52 PM
But like you said, it dont really matter. Nvidia have never really insist on this... and we understand why now. But i agree, there's no drama to do with that..
With all the bullsh is writing Nvidia in this kepler presentation page, one less, one more.
But like you said, it dont really matter. Nvidia have never really insist on this... and we understand why now. But i agree, there's no drama to do with that..
With all the bullsh is writing Nvidia in this kepler presentation page, one less, one more.
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#4461428 Posted on: 11/23/2012 04:04 PM
Who cares. There's only a handful of games that properly support DX11 right now anyway.
Who cares. There's only a handful of games that properly support DX11 right now anyway.
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#4461430 Posted on: 11/23/2012 04:10 PM
AMD's marketing.
Who cares
AMD's marketing.
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#4461440 Posted on: 11/23/2012 04:16 PM
@Lane: Strange, I wonder why Nvidia would mention it on their site but not in the Kepler Whitepaper.
@Lane: Strange, I wonder why Nvidia would mention it on their site but not in the Kepler Whitepaper.
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#4461463 Posted on: 11/23/2012 04:55 PM
For be honest, im done with this story, its not like it will change anything anyway in close future for 600 series user.. so time to move to something else i think.
@Lane: Strange, I wonder why Nvidia would mention it on their site but not in the Kepler Whitepaper.
For be honest, im done with this story, its not like it will change anything anyway in close future for 600 series user.. so time to move to something else i think.
Click here to post a comment for this news story on the message forum.
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Who cares, Most game developers arent even DX10 compliant.