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Downgrading from Windows 8 to Windows 7
Posted by Hilbert Hagedoorn on: 11/26/2012 08:59 AM | 62 comment(s) ]
In his blog post, usability expert Jakob Nielsen of the Nielsen Norman Group explained in excruciating detail exactly why and how Windows 8 is difficult to use. It was a damning report that might have many questioning whether to take the Windows 8 plunge. The good news is you can buy a PC loaded with Windows 8 Pro, try out the new OS, and then downgrade to Windows 7. Unfortunately, however, the road back to Windows 7 can be confusing and full of twists.
Hewlett-Packard is typical: It does not support downgrades of consumer-grade Windows 8 PCs to Windows 7. But if you buy a machine loaded with Windows 8 Pro, you can make the jump. HP's policy is based on Microsoft's licensing terms, which support downgrade rights only to new PCs preloaded with Windows 8 Pro, the version of Windows designed for business.
Unfortunately, machines loaded with Windows 8 Pro will demand a pricing premium over similarly spec'd Windows 8 systems. We ran a quick comparison survey of machines from HP, Dell, and Toshiba, and found that an upgrade to the Pro version of Windows 8 increased system prices anywhere between $35 and $100.
And even when the price delta is small enough to justify buying a Windows 8 Pro machine (complete with downgrade rights!), the downgrade process can still be difficult to figure out. When PCWorld researched this, sales and support reps for both Microsoft and major PC manufacturers told us two different stories.
A Dell representative said that to downgrade from Windows 8, you needed to buy a new, unused copy of Windows 7—thus making the whole point of having downgrade rights pointless. Another representative said a Windows 7 disc image would be built into new Windows 8 Pro machines. This contradicts pretty much everything Microsoft has ever posted online about downgrade rights.
But after scouring Microsoft's online support pages, checking out real-world downgrade experiences on various forums, and then confirming the process with Microsoft's press team, we can now share the truth about how downgrades work for anyone with a PC running Windows 8 Pro.
Downgrading from Windows 8 to Windows 7
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HP now available:Mini-Note PCs with Windows XP as a downgrade - 05/13/2008 05:30 AM
HP 2133 Mini-Note PC- models One note: Genuine Windows Vista Business installed but downgraded to Genuine Windows XP Professional. http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/us/en/sm/WF25a/321957-321957-64295-...
Extraordinary
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#4463963 Posted on: 11/26/2012 10:59 PM
Considering it was about 10/90 6 months ago, 50/50 is actually very impressive and clearly shows that there is a lot to be gained from W8 for those who are willing to invest the time.
If its still 50/50 in 1-2 years then it could be considered a failure, but with more people seeming to come round every day and a new breed of first time laptop buyers who will only know W8, I just dont see it doing anything other than increasing in popularity as time goes on.
I forced myself to use W8 with zero third party tools, its hard at first as youre outside your comfort zone, but after I realised the reliance was back on the keyboard and away from the mouse I started to come round.
Downgrading to W7 is only just making things easier for yourself in the short term, as the jump to Windows 9 from 7 will be all the more alien and uncomfortable for you.
Absolutely nothing to do with being 'out of my comfort zone'
I have no problem adapting to new OS's, I am very comfortable with all Windows OS's, but it doesn't change the fact that Windows 8 and all it's Metro crappness and other unnecessary 'tweaks' that make things take twice as long is absolutely NOT for the desktop PC
Let me make one example, the new Copy window, with 7 if you try to copy a file into a dir with a file of the same name / many files with the same name, it asks "Overwrite or Keep both Files"
With 8, you have to open a whole new dialogue box and tick mark the files you want to keep / overwrite
Pointless changes to a system that didn't need changing
Improve code and make things faster, fine, don't change things that worked fine
Considering it was about 10/90 6 months ago, 50/50 is actually very impressive and clearly shows that there is a lot to be gained from W8 for those who are willing to invest the time.
If its still 50/50 in 1-2 years then it could be considered a failure, but with more people seeming to come round every day and a new breed of first time laptop buyers who will only know W8, I just dont see it doing anything other than increasing in popularity as time goes on.
I forced myself to use W8 with zero third party tools, its hard at first as youre outside your comfort zone, but after I realised the reliance was back on the keyboard and away from the mouse I started to come round.
Downgrading to W7 is only just making things easier for yourself in the short term, as the jump to Windows 9 from 7 will be all the more alien and uncomfortable for you.
Absolutely nothing to do with being 'out of my comfort zone'
I have no problem adapting to new OS's, I am very comfortable with all Windows OS's, but it doesn't change the fact that Windows 8 and all it's Metro crappness and other unnecessary 'tweaks' that make things take twice as long is absolutely NOT for the desktop PC
Let me make one example, the new Copy window, with 7 if you try to copy a file into a dir with a file of the same name / many files with the same name, it asks "Overwrite or Keep both Files"
With 8, you have to open a whole new dialogue box and tick mark the files you want to keep / overwrite
Pointless changes to a system that didn't need changing
Improve code and make things faster, fine, don't change things that worked fine
Extraordinary
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#4463964 Posted on: 11/26/2012 11:00 PM
How come if you like it then your a "fanboi" but if you don't like it then your just seeing it for what it is.
That's just arrogant double standards.
Nothing wrong with not liking it, but if you want people to respect that you think you valid opinion and your not just going along wiht the crowd, then you have to respect the opinion of those who do like it.
Fanboi = people who stick up for crap just because they can't handle the fact that a company made a mistake / treat their product as their very own love child and by insulting it you are insulting their mother
Liking something = completely different, anyone with half a brain knows Vista and 8 are crap
How come if you like it then your a "fanboi" but if you don't like it then your just seeing it for what it is.
That's just arrogant double standards.
Nothing wrong with not liking it, but if you want people to respect that you think you valid opinion and your not just going along wiht the crowd, then you have to respect the opinion of those who do like it.
Fanboi = people who stick up for crap just because they can't handle the fact that a company made a mistake / treat their product as their very own love child and by insulting it you are insulting their mother
Liking something = completely different, anyone with half a brain knows Vista and 8 are crap
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#4463974 Posted on: 11/26/2012 11:13 PM
Sounds exactly like out your comfort zone, just too stubborn to admit it.
The fanboi thing is just nonsense, i bet you will still be arguing that crap when the majority of people are on W8, and those people will no oubt make fun of you in the same way that W7 users make fun of people who used W7 in classic mode, or even worse clung to XP when it was way past its best.
Sounds exactly like out your comfort zone, just too stubborn to admit it.
The fanboi thing is just nonsense, i bet you will still be arguing that crap when the majority of people are on W8, and those people will no oubt make fun of you in the same way that W7 users make fun of people who used W7 in classic mode, or even worse clung to XP when it was way past its best.
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#4463980 Posted on: 11/26/2012 11:27 PM
Sounds exactly like out your comfort zone, just too stubborn to admit it.
The fanboi thing is just nonsense, i bet you will still be arguing that crap when the majority of people are on W8, and those people will no oubt make fun of you in the same way that W7 users make fun of people who used W7 in classic mode, or even worse clung to XP when it was way past its best.
How would I be out of my comfort zone exactly ?
I like my PC to work, I like things to take the shortest amount of time to get from A>B, I don't want useless Metro UI and other stupid things to make the whole process longer than necessary
New releases of an OS are supposed to improve the experience, maybe for people who just use their computers for entertainment and social media, Metro is very pretty for all that, but I don't use my machine for pretty pictures and bonny colours, I use it to do the job I tell it to.
If a mechanic opened the bonnet of a car and was greeted by fairy lights and cotton wool, I have a feeling he would not be impressed having to fight through it all until he finally reached the nuts and bolts to actually get the job done
You want lovely colours, buy a paint by numbers kit, you want a PC that does the job you ask it, install 7
Sounds exactly like out your comfort zone, just too stubborn to admit it.
The fanboi thing is just nonsense, i bet you will still be arguing that crap when the majority of people are on W8, and those people will no oubt make fun of you in the same way that W7 users make fun of people who used W7 in classic mode, or even worse clung to XP when it was way past its best.
How would I be out of my comfort zone exactly ?
I like my PC to work, I like things to take the shortest amount of time to get from A>B, I don't want useless Metro UI and other stupid things to make the whole process longer than necessary
New releases of an OS are supposed to improve the experience, maybe for people who just use their computers for entertainment and social media, Metro is very pretty for all that, but I don't use my machine for pretty pictures and bonny colours, I use it to do the job I tell it to.
If a mechanic opened the bonnet of a car and was greeted by fairy lights and cotton wool, I have a feeling he would not be impressed having to fight through it all until he finally reached the nuts and bolts to actually get the job done
You want lovely colours, buy a paint by numbers kit, you want a PC that does the job you ask it, install 7
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#4463985 Posted on: 11/26/2012 11:40 PM
Not everyone operates a PC like you do, while i'm not saying you can't do things quicker in 7, it's just plain wrong to think everyone else will also share your experience.
So far i still prefer 7 over 8, but from what i've saw over the last 3 days it's certainly more efficient once you get bearings.
It's funny, we have one W8 hater saying that it's a better OS than 7 but it's ugly, while your saying its a worse OS, but it's pretty.
Not everyone operates a PC like you do, while i'm not saying you can't do things quicker in 7, it's just plain wrong to think everyone else will also share your experience.
So far i still prefer 7 over 8, but from what i've saw over the last 3 days it's certainly more efficient once you get bearings.
It's funny, we have one W8 hater saying that it's a better OS than 7 but it's ugly, while your saying its a worse OS, but it's pretty.
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#4463991 Posted on: 11/26/2012 11:46 PM
Not everyone operates a PC like you do, while i'm not saying you can't do things quicker in 7, it's just plain wrong to think everyone else will also share your experience.
So far i still prefer 7 over 8, but from what i've saw over the last 3 days it's certainly more efficient once you get bearings.
It's funny, we have one W8 hater saying that it's a better OS than 7 but it's ugly, while your saying its a worse OS, but it's pretty.
Yea I said 'pretty' as an insult, I don't want a pretty PC
Not sure why we ended up having this conversation if you prefer 7 over 8 too...
Each to their own, but as far as OS's go, 8 doesn't hack it for me, it had great potential in terms of speed but they broke it for RTM, leaving users no choice is not the way to go
Not everyone operates a PC like you do, while i'm not saying you can't do things quicker in 7, it's just plain wrong to think everyone else will also share your experience.
So far i still prefer 7 over 8, but from what i've saw over the last 3 days it's certainly more efficient once you get bearings.
It's funny, we have one W8 hater saying that it's a better OS than 7 but it's ugly, while your saying its a worse OS, but it's pretty.
Yea I said 'pretty' as an insult, I don't want a pretty PC
Not sure why we ended up having this conversation if you prefer 7 over 8 too...
Each to their own, but as far as OS's go, 8 doesn't hack it for me, it had great potential in terms of speed but they broke it for RTM, leaving users no choice is not the way to go
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#4463992 Posted on: 11/26/2012 11:46 PM
More arrogance from the hate8 crowd.... Seems some of these "power users" need to learn how to actually use a computer. I see "Metro" at startup....that's it. I can access everything I need without ever seeing "Metro" aside from that. I have yet to find a single function that actually takes longer in Win8. If you want to hate on Windows8, fine....but at least use some actual facts in your arguments against it. This bull**** (which is exactly what it is) about everything taking longer is getting old. If you can't figure out how to work at OS and "customize" it....you're far from a "power user" and should be embarrassed as hell to call yourself an enthusiast (cuz some of us are embarrassed by you).
More arrogance from the hate8 crowd.... Seems some of these "power users" need to learn how to actually use a computer. I see "Metro" at startup....that's it. I can access everything I need without ever seeing "Metro" aside from that. I have yet to find a single function that actually takes longer in Win8. If you want to hate on Windows8, fine....but at least use some actual facts in your arguments against it. This bull**** (which is exactly what it is) about everything taking longer is getting old. If you can't figure out how to work at OS and "customize" it....you're far from a "power user" and should be embarrassed as hell to call yourself an enthusiast (cuz some of us are embarrassed by you).
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#4463995 Posted on: 11/26/2012 11:48 PM
men, this is all very silly. like redmption says we wil ALL be usin win8 bfore long even if u dont liek it. so u may aswell get an like it now so u can enjoy it like all of us here. if u get confuised in win8 we are here to help u get thru it and will give u the help u need.
and if u think win9 will be not the same, well it will. ms haev speant too much money on the win8 style for it to fail. the more intelli gent users on this forum u will see use an support windows8 supportin this fact that u just need to adopt to it. SOONER before later.
phew
men, this is all very silly. like redmption says we wil ALL be usin win8 bfore long even if u dont liek it. so u may aswell get an like it now so u can enjoy it like all of us here. if u get confuised in win8 we are here to help u get thru it and will give u the help u need.
and if u think win9 will be not the same, well it will. ms haev speant too much money on the win8 style for it to fail. the more intelli gent users on this forum u will see use an support windows8 supportin this fact that u just need to adopt to it. SOONER before later.
phew
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#4463997 Posted on: 11/26/2012 11:50 PM
thanku, me an u think alike i am tierd of this win8 basting too.
More arrogance from the hate8 crowd.... Seems some of these "power users" need to learn how to actually use a computer. I see "Metro" at startup....that's it. I can access everything I need without ever seeing "Metro" aside from that. I have yet to find a single function that actually takes longer in Win8. If you want to hate on Windows8, fine....but at least use some actual facts in your arguments against it. This bull**** (which is exactly what it is) about everything taking longer is getting old. If you can't figure out how to work at OS and "customize" it....you're far from a "power user" and should be embarrassed as hell to call yourself an enthusiast (cuz some of us are embarrassed by you).
thanku, me an u think alike i am tierd of this win8 basting too.
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#4463999 Posted on: 11/26/2012 11:53 PM
You forgot to read the thread in your haste to protect 8 ?
If you had read it, you would have seen an example of 8 taking longer than 7
Anyway, enough of this, I`m not hanging around the bois any more, enjoy your 'experience'
More arrogance from the hate8 crowd.... Seems some of these "power users" need to learn how to actually use a computer. I see "Metro" at startup....that's it. I can access everything I need without ever seeing "Metro" aside from that. I have yet to find a single function that actually takes longer in Win8. If you want to hate on Windows8, fine....but at least use some actual facts in your arguments against it. This bull**** (which is exactly what it is) about everything taking longer is getting old. If you can't figure out how to work at OS and "customize" it....you're far from a "power user" and should be embarrassed as hell to call yourself an enthusiast (cuz some of us are embarrassed by you).
You forgot to read the thread in your haste to protect 8 ?
If you had read it, you would have seen an example of 8 taking longer than 7
Anyway, enough of this, I`m not hanging around the bois any more, enjoy your 'experience'
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#4464025 Posted on: 11/27/2012 12:28 AM
You know, you come across as quite arrogant yourself...
More arrogance from the hate8 crowd.... Seems some of these "power users" need to learn how to actually use a computer. I see "Metro" at startup....that's it. I can access everything I need without ever seeing "Metro" aside from that. I have yet to find a single function that actually takes longer in Win8. If you want to hate on Windows8, fine....but at least use some actual facts in your arguments against it. This bull**** (which is exactly what it is) about everything taking longer is getting old. If you can't figure out how to work at OS and "customize" it....you're far from a "power user" and should be embarrassed as hell to call yourself an enthusiast (cuz some of us are embarrassed by you).
You know, you come across as quite arrogant yourself...
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#4464026 Posted on: 11/27/2012 12:29 AM
I did read the thread. And the "fanbois" statements are pretty pathetic. The hate8 bandwagon roadies label anyone that likes Windows8 as "fanbois"....and those that hate Windows8 as "seeing things clearly". That is pure arrogance. If you can't respect someone else's opinion, you make your own opinion worthless.
I've been using Windows8 since RTM. There is literally NOTHING I can't accomplish as fast or faster in Windows8 than Windows7.
I'm assuming you're referring to the example I've quoted below....which is wrong.
Let me make one example, the new Copy window, with 7 if you try to copy a file into a dir with a file of the same name / many files with the same name, it asks "Overwrite or Keep both Files"
With 8, you have to open a whole new dialogue box and tick mark the files you want to keep / overwrite
Funny, I did exactly that....and got a dialog box similar to that displayed in Windows7. I have the option to overwrite files, skip files, or select an action for each file. Lets stick to facts please.... The lies are getting pathetic.
You know, you come across as quite arrogant yourself...
No, I'm irritated by all the lie filled rhetoric. People can't find anything factual to support their hate of Windows8, so instead they post lies. When someone points out the lies, they're called "fanbois". If someone likes Windows8, they're called "fanbois". **** is getting old.
Do I like Win8 in general? Yes. Do I like every aspect of Win8? Not even close. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but there's no excuse for spouting blatant lies to dissuade others from even giving Windows8 a chance. Let people form their own opinions based on actual facts.
I did read the thread. And the "fanbois" statements are pretty pathetic. The hate8 bandwagon roadies label anyone that likes Windows8 as "fanbois"....and those that hate Windows8 as "seeing things clearly". That is pure arrogance. If you can't respect someone else's opinion, you make your own opinion worthless.
I've been using Windows8 since RTM. There is literally NOTHING I can't accomplish as fast or faster in Windows8 than Windows7.
I'm assuming you're referring to the example I've quoted below....which is wrong.
Let me make one example, the new Copy window, with 7 if you try to copy a file into a dir with a file of the same name / many files with the same name, it asks "Overwrite or Keep both Files"
With 8, you have to open a whole new dialogue box and tick mark the files you want to keep / overwrite
Funny, I did exactly that....and got a dialog box similar to that displayed in Windows7. I have the option to overwrite files, skip files, or select an action for each file. Lets stick to facts please.... The lies are getting pathetic.
You know, you come across as quite arrogant yourself...
No, I'm irritated by all the lie filled rhetoric. People can't find anything factual to support their hate of Windows8, so instead they post lies. When someone points out the lies, they're called "fanbois". If someone likes Windows8, they're called "fanbois". **** is getting old.
Do I like Win8 in general? Yes. Do I like every aspect of Win8? Not even close. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but there's no excuse for spouting blatant lies to dissuade others from even giving Windows8 a chance. Let people form their own opinions based on actual facts.
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#4464039 Posted on: 11/27/2012 12:42 AM
(...)
Funny, I did exactly that....and got a dialog box similar to that displayed in Windows7. I have the option to overwrite files, skip files, or select an action for each file. Lets stick to facts please.... The lies are getting pathetic.
Yeah, +it when showing copy conflicts it explicitly says when the displayed group of files has the same name, size and modification time - no need for Total Commander.
But if someone hates, they will hate. When Windows 2000 and XP were released, some were saying that their new solutions suck and 98 is better. "People hated" Vista Start Menu, and when it was virtually the same in Win7 it was said to be great, etc.
Regarding 8->7 downgrade, the rules should be pretty straightforward and I hope MS will explain it so there are no questions left, so everyone in need would know if and when they can downgrade. Again, it'll mostly affect corporate users, and they often have special agreements.
(...)
Funny, I did exactly that....and got a dialog box similar to that displayed in Windows7. I have the option to overwrite files, skip files, or select an action for each file. Lets stick to facts please.... The lies are getting pathetic.
Yeah, +it when showing copy conflicts it explicitly says when the displayed group of files has the same name, size and modification time - no need for Total Commander.
But if someone hates, they will hate. When Windows 2000 and XP were released, some were saying that their new solutions suck and 98 is better. "People hated" Vista Start Menu, and when it was virtually the same in Win7 it was said to be great, etc.
Regarding 8->7 downgrade, the rules should be pretty straightforward and I hope MS will explain it so there are no questions left, so everyone in need would know if and when they can downgrade. Again, it'll mostly affect corporate users, and they often have special agreements.
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#4464041 Posted on: 11/27/2012 12:43 AM
Meh, personally I like Metro UI. Wasn't a fan of it at first, but I've been rolling with it for about a week or so now and I'm liking it a lot. Seems big and bulky, but flows very nice.
Also, let's not start to throw insults now.
Meh, personally I like Metro UI. Wasn't a fan of it at first, but I've been rolling with it for about a week or so now and I'm liking it a lot. Seems big and bulky, but flows very nice.
Also, let's not start to throw insults now.
Click here to post a comment for this news story on the message forum.
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How come if you like it then your a "fanboi" but if you don't like it then your just seeing it for what it is.
That's just arrogant double standards.
Nothing wrong with not liking it, but if you want people to respect that you think you valid opinion and your not just going along wiht the crowd, then you have to respect the opinion of those who do like it.